Poll

Do you want to start lynching by majority this round?

Yes
7 (87.5%)
No
1 (12.5%)

Total Members Voted: 8

Voting closed: February 24, 2021, 10:57:44 AM


Pages: 1 ... 67 [68] 69 ... 123

Werewolf 24: Attack on Titan
Posts: 1842 Views: 86181

HumanDawn
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  • Vro's voting and unvoting still remains questionable to me , after all , if he turns out as a scum , he will have the best knowledge about lynch consequences . Either way , I have strong gut feelings , that Vro will be lynched in all certainty . Ig everyone would be happy to remove one suspect of the list of scum than keep one hoping him to be innocent . Sorry Vro if this hurts u , but u made a bad name for urself. I hope u understand whatever the play is here , u have drawn far too much suspicion

    this post raises !!! in my head

    “ye bro sorry if you’re good man you brought it on yourself not because our thinking could be wrong”

    This was a decoy sort of post i would say . What i was looking for was retaliation , which unfortunately took place before this post as many cited Vro's chance of being a townie and no one . I looked out for people who did not retaliate , because even after the best defenses and clarifications i stubbornly stood on my words , and said things as if it was fixed that Vro will be lynched by the town . The post did not go very well , as i did not receive counters until now , and here I am justifying why i did it . It was just a measure to clear out some people out of suspicion momentarily

    Looking for retaliation makes sense. This post makes me feel a lot better about you. Your late vote on Ruguo at the end pings me, but... ehh?

    I had to get my options reduced , I was pretty much sure that Vro was townie by then . However my doubts over the rest cleared up when Ruguo went in hot against Vro at the last moment, which looked like a vain push to me to save himself from getting lynched . And so the late voting . I was probably the 3rd/4th person voting for ruguo . Also voting and unvoting has got some big chaos running already , its better to vote once even if its late😅

    I think your vote was way later than that. If I get to rereading the thread, I'll pay more attention to wagonicomics.

    Not gonna lie , its possible that i was late , i mentioned in a post above that i did not go through 3-4 pages , because it was getting late for me to vote. Maybe votes were in those pages and i kept those out of my calculation of chronology

    That makes... sense.

    If you're scum here as your first game... you're a good liar!
    HumanDawn
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    HumanDawn
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  • Players:
    1. Ruguo
    2. Red Mones
    3. Vroendal
    4. Gerrick
    5. Adorable Oracle Hapi
    6. Anubhav Ghosh
    7. Sapphiron - Cop
    8. Wischland
    9. Minish
    10. Michi
    11. Imaginative Kane
    12. BraveSirRobin
    13. TGN
    14. Wintermoot
    15. NyghtOwl
    16. Melehan
    17. Doc
    18. Ogun of Valeria / Legacy of Smiles
    19. Alexander Valentine / ExLight
    20. cozmikrae
    21. Eastern New England / HumanDawn


    Final Vote Count:

    Gerrick - 1 (Red Mones)
    Sapphiron - 6 (Minish, Imaginative Kane, TGN, Wintermoot, Legacy of Smiles, Human Dawn)
    BraveSirRobin - 2 (Gerrick, NyghtOwl)

    TGN - 6 (Vroendal, Sapphiron, Wischland, BraveSirRobin, Doc, ExLight)

    Not voting: Anubhav Ghosh, Cozmikrae, Michi

    From Day 3 EoD, I'm mostly bothered with Cozmikrae for his unvote putting a soft PR at risk and Anubhav Ghosh ignoring the Sapphiron soft claim. ExLight said he didn't necessarily trust the soft PR claim, but his vote was actually on TGN, not Sapphiron, so I can't really get bothered by that (sorry ExLight for the disappointed comment earlier).

    I am okay with throwing TGN a bone for voting Sapphiron for survival and in the case that Sapphiron could be scum to help clear him, and he's new at the game too.

    I want to know where @Imaginative Kane, @Wintermoot and @Legacy of Smile were doing. For me and Minish we weren't around EoD and I was asleep when the softclaim happened. Phase updates at 7AM and I didn't make an alarm to wake up at that time.

    Out of Cozmikrae and Anubhav Ghosh, I don't know which one bothers me more. They were both off plays. Cozmikrae comes off as more experienced than Anubhav to me, so his play is more suspect.

    Vote: Cozmikrae

    Talking of experience , this is my first werewolf game in my whole history of life , plz bear with me and the total ignorance about the soft claim , i didn't even know what softening up meant  :'( .

    That's fine, I didn't know this was your first game. That makes sense, and matches up with wanting somebody to tell you who to vote. Sorry if I missed it or forgot, but why did you follow Vroendal? I'm assuming it's because you trust him the most, but maybe there's some history out of the game where he recommended you join it or something.
    1 person likes this post: Anubhav Ghosh
    HumanDawn
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    HumanDawn
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  • Players:
    1. Ruguo
    2. Red Mones
    3. Vroendal
    4. Gerrick
    5. Adorable Oracle Hapi
    6. Anubhav Ghosh
    7. Sapphiron - Cop
    8. Wischland
    9. Minish
    10. Michi
    11. Imaginative Kane
    12. BraveSirRobin
    13. TGN
    14. Wintermoot
    15. NyghtOwl
    16. Melehan
    17. Doc
    18. Ogun of Valeria / Legacy of Smiles
    19. Alexander Valentine / ExLight
    20. cozmikrae
    21. Eastern New England / HumanDawn


    Final Vote Count:

    Gerrick - 1 (Red Mones)
    Sapphiron - 6 (Minish, Imaginative Kane, TGN, Wintermoot, Legacy of Smiles, Human Dawn)
    BraveSirRobin - 2 (Gerrick, NyghtOwl)

    TGN - 6 (Vroendal, Sapphiron, Wischland, BraveSirRobin, Doc, ExLight)

    Not voting: Anubhav Ghosh, Cozmikrae, Michi

    From Day 3 EoD, I'm mostly bothered with Cozmikrae for his unvote putting a soft PR at risk and Anubhav Ghosh ignoring the Sapphiron soft claim. ExLight said he didn't necessarily trust the soft PR claim, but his vote was actually on TGN, not Sapphiron, so I can't really get bothered by that (sorry ExLight for the disappointed comment earlier).

    I am okay with throwing TGN a bone for voting Sapphiron for survival and in the case that Sapphiron could be scum to help clear him, and he's new at the game too.

    I want to know where @Imaginative Kane, @Wintermoot and @Legacy of Smile were doing. For me and Minish we weren't around EoD and I was asleep when the softclaim happened. Phase updates at 7AM and I didn't make an alarm to wake up at that time.

    Out of Cozmikrae and Anubhav Ghosh, I don't know which one bothers me more. They were both off plays. Cozmikrae comes off as more experienced than Anubhav to me, so his play is more suspect.

    Vote: Cozmikrae

    I am a she btw.

    So... actually this is my lack of experience showing here. I understood that Sapph was softing a role, but as I wasn't voting for him, I wasn't concerned with it. But at the end, I got caught up in sudden flash of intuition and last minute scum reads (Vro, Ghosh and ExLight). Suddenly concerned that I was lynching a townie, I jumped off the boat, forgetting to consider that I was putting a potential power role in danger. Hindsight is 20/20, I won't be doing that again. I completely agree, a vanilla townie TGN should have been sacrificed to save the seer. The whole concept of wagonomics and how my vote factors into influencing a lynch I didn't personally vote for is kinda new to me.

    Quite a few noobies here... My biggest issue is how late the unvote was. You got a sudden flash and last minute reads exactly before EoD? I feel like that's a bit harder to believe. Anubhav claims ignorance to the situation, but you knew about the power role and what the lynch would mean.

    Do you have other reads at least? Who would you vote today? (unless you have already voted somebody else, in which case ignore this part and i will check it out)
    1 person likes this post: Legacy of Smiles
    HumanDawn
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    HumanDawn
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  • But him voting TGN would’ve increased the gap and most likely prevented the Lynch from happening, right?
    Yes, it would have. From my point of view at the time Sapph's lynch was being prevented. I was voting TGN who was in the majority, I told Anubhav to vote on another wagon. I don't blame Anubhav for not voting past that point, but I admit I probably could have pushed him harder. I should mention that I was also town-reading TGN. I did not forsee cozmik's flip, which isn't really an excuse, but I could ask you why you didn't prevent the lynch either.
    Me? I though Sapph was scum bluffing. In any case I already had my vote on TGN, there wasn’t much for me to do.

    Lame.

    Even if he is scum bluffing, we would have known he was lying later down the game if the three confirmed power roles die, or suspect him more based on whether he stayed alive or not. What made you think he was scum bluffing specifically here? I expect a lot more from you on something like this...
    It’s a bit trickier than this because claiming is not allowed, so there’s always that WIFOM on whether or not it really is a soft. In any case waiting for 3 power roles to die is kinda brutal and the odds of hitting -Lo with at least one of them alive isn’t small at all. Not to mention he could always kill all people that realized the soft until then, and leave only inexperienced players that didn’t realize it around to get away with it even if all Power Roles flipped.

    I expected him to bluff because I’m aware he’s an experienced player and he’d know this is the best play for scum. His actions of laying low were ambiguous at best, I’d’ve been way more likely to think it was legit if he had put more effort scumhunting umu

    It's not brutal when scum wants them killed. Two can die, and the third can soft to kind of counterclaim Sapph if it ever reaches that point. Saying that he could always kill the people that realized the soft is meaningless because for him to know they realized it they either have to hint at it really subtly or out it, in which case everyone knows about the soft already and killing them specifically doesn't affect anything.

    I can see how you'd expect him to bluff to save himself - but then he could always be telling the truth about it even with putting less effort and it would be worth giving him a chance at least.
    HumanDawn
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    Anubhav Ghosh
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  • Players:
    1. Ruguo
    2. Red Mones
    3. Vroendal
    4. Gerrick
    5. Adorable Oracle Hapi
    6. Anubhav Ghosh
    7. Sapphiron - Cop
    8. Wischland
    9. Minish
    10. Michi
    11. Imaginative Kane
    12. BraveSirRobin
    13. TGN
    14. Wintermoot
    15. NyghtOwl
    16. Melehan
    17. Doc
    18. Ogun of Valeria / Legacy of Smiles
    19. Alexander Valentine / ExLight
    20. cozmikrae
    21. Eastern New England / HumanDawn


    Final Vote Count:

    Gerrick - 1 (Red Mones)
    Sapphiron - 6 (Minish, Imaginative Kane, TGN, Wintermoot, Legacy of Smiles, Human Dawn)
    BraveSirRobin - 2 (Gerrick, NyghtOwl)

    TGN - 6 (Vroendal, Sapphiron, Wischland, BraveSirRobin, Doc, ExLight)

    Not voting: Anubhav Ghosh, Cozmikrae, Michi

    From Day 3 EoD, I'm mostly bothered with Cozmikrae for his unvote putting a soft PR at risk and Anubhav Ghosh ignoring the Sapphiron soft claim. ExLight said he didn't necessarily trust the soft PR claim, but his vote was actually on TGN, not Sapphiron, so I can't really get bothered by that (sorry ExLight for the disappointed comment earlier).

    I am okay with throwing TGN a bone for voting Sapphiron for survival and in the case that Sapphiron could be scum to help clear him, and he's new at the game too.

    I want to know where @Imaginative Kane, @Wintermoot and @Legacy of Smile were doing. For me and Minish we weren't around EoD and I was asleep when the softclaim happened. Phase updates at 7AM and I didn't make an alarm to wake up at that time.

    Out of Cozmikrae and Anubhav Ghosh, I don't know which one bothers me more. They were both off plays. Cozmikrae comes off as more experienced than Anubhav to me, so his play is more suspect.

    Vote: Cozmikrae

    Talking of experience , this is my first werewolf game in my whole history of life , plz bear with me and the total ignorance about the soft claim , i didn't even know what softening up meant  :'( .

    That's fine, I didn't know this was your first game. That makes sense, and matches up with wanting somebody to tell you who to vote. Sorry if I missed it or forgot, but why did you follow Vroendal? I'm assuming it's because you trust him the most, but maybe there's some history out of the game where he recommended you join it or something.

    I do trust him a lot , maybe my top town guy . His defenses back in D2 spoke for his trustworthiness .

    But the problem in in trusting in this game😅
    Anubhav Ghosh
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    HumanDawn
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  • Well, you asked lol.

    Why I scumread Kane:

    Spoiler
    Quote
    This is also something I am wondering about after reading through posts on the topic.

    For now I will use my No Lynch vote but that will change later on since I am sure some other players will eventually look more suspicious.
    Melehan has been triggering some of my suspicion because from what I remember when reading and playing previous Werewolf games, the players who were committed to a role in all of their posts were usually evil or just hiding something.  Hapi in the last game proved an exception to the evil players posting in character but I think the Batman game had a few cases like that (and then there are the "generic Batman quotes").

    There's nothing specific that pings me in this post but there's not a whole lot accomplished either. Mostly saying they sus Mekehan and then arguing against their sus on Melehan and then saying they want to NL. Seems more likely a wolf makes this post trying to fit in and not post many opinions of their own.

    Quote
    An updated vote track.  As of Vroendal's count it was like this:

    Hapi 2 (Red, Melehan)
    Red 2 (Hapi, cozmikrae)
    Michi 2 (Gerrick, Vroendal)
    Wintermoot 1 (NyghtOwl)
    Doc 1 (Ruguo)
    Vroendal 1 (Sapphiron)
    Sapphiron 1 (TGN)

    Ruguo then voted for Michi to apply some pressure.
    Not sure if TGN's post after that was voting for Michi since they had their vote on Sapphiron and then said Unvote: Michi.
    NyghtOwl then changed their vote to Hapi thinking Wintermoot was just like voting a third party candidate and citing the potential for chaos.
    Then TGN changed their vote to a joke vote on Laurentus. (for editing a post)
    Then I made my No Lynch vote (pending more information).
    Hapi then changed their vote to cozmikrae. (jumping on a joke wagon but not convincing Hapi why)

    Hapi 3 (Red, Melehan, NyghtOwl)
    Red 1 (cozmikrae)
    Michi 3 (Gerrick, Vroendal, Ruguo)
    Vroendal 1 (Sapphiron)
    Laurentus 1 (TGN)
    cozmikrae 1 (Hapi)
    No Lynch 1 (Kane)

    I will check this game later but now I am going to focus on school stuff.
    While this is very useful, it is also actually the post that first pinged me on Kane when I was reading. Seems like IIoA (information instead of analysis) where a beginner wolf tries to look universally helpful by spending a lot of time posting objective facts like the posts below. It's not wolfy that Kane is posting info posts like these, and they are very helpful, but it is wolfy that a good proportion of Kane's posts are completely objective info with no strong opinions of his own.


    Quote
    While I would rather vote No Lynch, I am not actually planning to.  I am just using it as a placeholder which I thought I made clear with that wording.  Also what information could I hand out without pinning a target on me?  It is only D1.

    This is a really weird thing for a townsperson to think / say and emphasises the blending in mindset I saw before. I don't see why a townsperson would want to blend in like this.

    Quote
    The main player I am not at all suspicious of so far is NyghtOwl.  I like their original voting justification so for now I will go off of that in case I am not active before the day ends.  BSR seems a bit too quiet so far but they haven't been online for a while so that is somewhat excusable.  I really don't have any plausible suspicions so far.  Just weak suspicions of Robin, Melehan, and Minish.  I just have a gut feeling with Minish for some reason.  Neither Hapi nor Michi seem scummy to me.  Everyone else is generally on the same level as Hapi and Michi, neither suspicious nor not suspicious.

    I will vote BraveSirRobin for now since they fit the bill and I wonder if they are doing what I often do: view the forums without logging in.

    The argument on BSR is very weak here... so why are they still tunneling this person on D4? Kane even makes an excuse for BSR in this post. I also want to draw attention to the NyghtOwl read as not being anything original because Nyght was probably the most consensus town read at this point in the thread. I also don't think that this person is partnered with Nyght (although to be honest Nyght is probably just town anyway so this shouldn't matter much).


    Quote
    I think I now understand why I always seem so suspicious to yall when I play. (Even if I don't seem that suspicious yet for once)  My meta seems to be suspicious overall.  I am usually somewhat quiet whether I am town or scum.  Whether or not there are neutral roles, I am definitely a tightwad when it comes to giving information which is probably partially out of paranoia that I will immediately be targeted by enemies or breaking the rules if I open up.  Plus I tend to get rather defensive (maybe not as much as Aragonn though).

    A notable part of my meta that is not too hard to confirm by reading through past games is that I tend to avoid wagons unless I agree with them (regardless of which side I am on) or I feel the need to join them for self preservation.  Also I tend to vote off of hunches when I make my votes unless the reasons for a vote seem sound and I agree with them enough to vote the same.  Seeing how big talking seems to be, I understand why I tend to be suspicious.  When asked, I will say I am innocent but can not confirm (who wouldn't in this kind of game).

    For talk about the meta of others.  I have read a few of the previous games and Gerrick seems to be the meta I feel I have the best understanding of.  That meta seems to be always relatively quiet and contributing to discussions and then either someone realizing they are scum or someone taking them out at night :)) (Though this is mostly from looking at Star Wars, Batman, and Game of Thrones).
    I may have some idea of Red's meta but he has played quite a few games I have not been in so I am not sure.  The Game of Thrones meta I remember was being quiet except to vote and sometimes discussing with their votes being primarily joining wagons (mostly at the Wall when they were scum).  I think some good points were made earlier about Red on both sides so I won't vote them.  I am a little less suspicious of Minish now but still have a lingering gut suspicion (getting vibes from that Portal Werewolf when we were both scum).  Otherwise, there isn't really any new suspicions to note.  Though I had forgotten about Wintermoot being quiet earlier for some reason.

    For now I will keep my vote in place.

    The defence part of this post pinged me at first for being wolfy although I'm not really sure how I feel about it now. I don't think saying that they do wolfy things as town really defends a lot of the things I've noticed so far more.


    Quote
    Oh hi Kane. Why don't I remember a single one of your posts from D1?

    Answer: I'm clearly inept at remember who all is playing. Carry on.
    Quote
    Don't worry about it Ruguo.  There have been quite a few posts so far.  Not as much as other games but there was definitely a lot in the posts.

    This interaction feels pretty forced. Could see these two as w/w.



    Quote
    [Well I won't be making as big of a post as I was planning to since I need to wake up earlier this morning.  Because of that, this will not be as elaborate as I would hope.

    My opposition to both the Michi and Hapi wagons yesterday was because I did not feel either were sus in any way yet.  I still do not see them as sus (makes sense for the latter since they were offed and revealed) but there have been some very good points made with the analyses of the wagons and their participants.  I am nearing a point where Michi could a target of my vote.

    Some of the players I am finding difficult to analyze include: Melehan, Vroendal, Minish, ENE, and Wischland.  Vroendal I have a fair bit of suspicion towards but they appear to be defending themselves well.  Melehan keeps flip flopping in my view between town and scum leaning with the different analyses and RP/flavor posts.  Minish has been quite helpful towards the town but at the same time, I have a nagging suspicion that they are playing a part as scum.  Wischland and Alexander Valentine and ENE have not posted enough for me to get a read of them based off what I have read so far.  I have a suspicion that somewhere in the group of BraveSirRobin, Wintermoot, Red, Vroendal, Minish, Ogun and others I am not thinking of right now; there is at least one Titan.  This is very much an unproved gut or vibe suspicion though.  I also wonder with Melehan and Vroendal how much of their post liking with the arguments for and against their suspiciousness is indicative of players being onto something with regards to their leanings.

    I would say TGN is null with a slight town lean so far.  While they keep making posts and votes that are explained away as jokes, something about them makes me think they are not that suspicious so far.
    Nyght, Anubhav, and cozmikrae are now in a sort of town lock position for the moment (temporarily with Anubhav since they haven't posted much but they are newly substituted and those posts have me convinced).  While I am not convinced of Red's suspiciousness or non suspicion, their defense combined with what I have seen of cozmik are making me think they are a player adjusting to this town setting but fitting in and trying to contribute.

    As a summary of these reads.
    Town Lock
    NyghtOwl (Are you playing us though?)
    cozmikrae ()
    Anubhav Ghosh (this probably won't last long, I am being generous since they are more of a lean but that remains to be seen)

    Town Lean
    Wintermoot (somewhat suspicious but you seem to be triggering my gut a little less than the others)
    TGN (reminds me of some of my own early games, more chaotic and less suspicious and not triggering my alarms)
    Michi (they seem to just be defending themselves and their resigned defense reminds me of a lot of mislynches)
    Gerrick (so far they have yet to set off an alarm)

    Null or not much of a read.
    Wischland (haven't seen much from their posts)
    Eastern New England (not as inactive but haven't seen much from their posts)
    Ogun of Valeria (same as Melehan)
    Melehan (Just don't know)
    Ruguo (same as the previous two)
    Alexander Valentine (no activity)
    Sapphiron (not sure even with I have read and remember)
    Red Mones (not as conflicting as the others but somewhat town leading and conflicting)

    Scum Lean
    BraveSirRobin (the defense did help but I need to reread it some more, really more of a null until that time)

    Conflicting Reads (definitely need more analysis since I am seeing signs of both sides or thinking I am seeing them)
    Minish (not suspicious in their posts but for some reason they are reminding me of when we were both wolves and seem to be holding something back (though that is normally not suspicious to me))
    Doc (I seem to be seeing a mixture of town and scum reads from my mind and others and I am being reminded of The Wall when they were scum)
    Vroendal (Appears to simultaneously be scum leaning and town leaning)]

    Probably Kane's best post and most of the reads seem fair. I want to point out two that stand out however. The NyghtOwl read has some unnecessary shade for... no reason? Weird, since Kane said they're not suspicious of Nyght at all earlier. The read on BSR is way too weak to justify how strongly Kane is tunneling them.


    Quote
    This day sure flew by fast and it was not fun (not the phase (though that was a lot to read through and I definitely have not studied it much)).  He is/was a similar case to a few of the people who I marked as null or not much to go off of in that there is a bit to go off of, but I have not been able to get a read off of their posts yet.

    I could be willing to go along with the Ruguo and Vroendal votes but I am not that suspicious of either one at the moment.  I will just vote for the one who I am most suspicious of right now.

    Vote BSR

    Just the right amount of distancing from Ruguo that I would expect from one of their partners. You can tell he doesn't want to vote for Ruguo here... "go along". If Kane is a wolf, Vro is probably town because I think Kane probably lists one wolf and one town in his list of two.

    Quote
    I was not actually intending to No Lynch and I did not officially use it since I changed my vote to BSR.  My reason for the early defensive posts is just to start preparing a defense early since I usually seem to be suspicious which often results in some wagon danger.

    That is true that I only voted for BSR, my reasoning for that was because I did not see agree with the major wagons that were up on those days (I found out how wrong that belief was last day phase but was correct on the first day phase).  The only reason I ever join those wagons is because I fully agree or mostly agree and find them suspicious.  Otherwise, I vote for someone else who I find suspicious despite it not making a difference.  That is just how I vote normally, sorry if that makes you suspicious of me.  The reason I have not pressured them in this day phase is because I have not been online for most of this day phase.  Yesterday, I simply did not open up this website or log in because I was starting on some assignments and watching some shows.  The one post I did make (https://wintreath.com/forums/index.php?topic=7019.msg156651#msg156651), I think explains well enough why I did not vote at that point in time.

    Bold is the wolfiest thing I have read all game. If you're town, you shouldn't be this paranoid about getting lynched as soon as D1 starts. I don't like the explanation for the BSR vote, it only amounts to BSR being suspicious for unknown reasons and not wanting to vote Michi / Hapi (this feels like wolf reasoning, a wolf not wanting to vote either Michi or Hapi because when one dies and is revealed to be town Kane wouldn't want to be suspected for it). Certainly don't think this justifies the BSR tunnel.


    Every other post I don't really have anything to comment on.


    Kane is in the solid scumread category right now. I don't think Kane and BSR are w/w though, so if one of those flips wolf I would townread the other.

    Oh and since I'm under the impression Kane is a newer player, I'll end this with a little advice for them. I would focus on sharing more opinions if you can. I can't tell if you're not because you're trying to avoid conflict or, if town, you're scared of being wrong but the best way to try to ease suspicions on you now isn't to try to justify yourself by telling us how you do this as town too but to do things that are towny like sharing more opinions.

    A question for Kane: what do you think of BSR now? Has your case against them got stronger since you first voted them? If not, why are you continuing to vote them if your reasoning is so weak? If you don't feel your reasoning is weak, please expand on it in more detail.

    Wow... nice post! Even though I don't agree with everything against Kane, I see where you're coming from in your analysis. I can see how the distance can be faked as well. My biggest peeve is the Town lock reads - Cozmikrae, Nyght Owl and Anubhav? I feel like they hadn't done much to justify being "locked".
    1 person likes this post: Legacy of Smiles
    HumanDawn
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    HumanDawn
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  • I'm not gonna lie, I'm hung up on BSR. The fact that I thought he should have been the counter d3 and wasn't, that Sapph originally voted him d3, that Kane has an odd connection voting for him 2 days in a row, that Silver kept pushing him but never voting for him, he was on Vro d2, and then possibly voted TGN for the towncred of not voting Sapph because scum could've just killed him at night anyways.

    But... what about BSR should have made him the counterwagon?
    HumanDawn
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    HumanDawn
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  • New tinfoil theory, TGN is the lynchproof scum and that’s why they were overlyconfident D2. A scumbuddy points out that even though he wouldn’t die from a lynch it would still expose him since he’s the only one like that. He then starts panicking at the idea of getting lynched.

    Not a terrible theory.
    HumanDawn
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    HumanDawn
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  • Unfortunately, you either trust me or you don't. I am not going to commit the same sin as I have done last game, allowing over-investment in the game to result in roleclaiming and rule breach. That will have to do to explain for my detached way of playing this round. You guys will find out whether you are right or wrong in lynching me soon enough.

    Also, I don't believe it's that implausible for a person to be given the scum role twice in a role. You guys make it sound like Doc wasn't consecutively Wolf before.

    I am more useful to Town alive than dead,
    Vote: TGN

    Bolded are the main hints. They were late into the day after most votes had happened, this is why the later vote shifts after these hints are the suspicious ones.
    Just outta curiosity, but when you say vote shifts are suspicious do you think votes jumping into Sapph or out of Sapph are worse?

    I’m a bit on the fence on what to expect from the scumteam in a scenario like this.

    Because of the way this setup is designed (with Sapph being nigh-unkillable if outed as seer thanks to the two defenders) I think wolves would probably be willing to make themselves suspicious in order to push a Sapphiron lynch. If I were a wolf, I would probably be willing to sacrifice the life of my most suspicious teammate in order to lynch the cop under these circumstances.

    Nothing was suspicious before the first Sapphiron soft claim post because I think making the wagons 3-3-3 was a fine decision.

    Doc - Passable response, they seem to have noticed the soft but not wanted to announce it at the time and made an effort, albeit a reasonably small one.

    ExLight - Not much to comment on this one tbh, null response. Relatively few Sapphiron interactions but stuck to other wagons the entire time.

    TGN - Passable because they seemed pretty oblivious to it, don't like the Sapph vote but I understand it was self preservation.

    Nyght - Good response, also doesn't seem to notice the soft but this time votes for BSR, which is a good look.

    Wintermoot - Alarm bells here. This person probably noticed the soft and still voted. Would like to hear their thoughts on why they did this.

    Kane - Oh dear. Votes Sapphiron, makes an excuse for not being able to chance his vote if Sapphiron makes  a good defence and then dips. I didn't even notice this on my ISO but yikes.

    BSR - Honestly the best response in the thread if we're assuming wolves were trying to lynch Sapphiron. Votes for the most viable counterwagon and tries to convince others to. If this person does flip wolf then my entire stance here is probably wrong but this reaction probably made me lean BSR as town.

    Vroendal - Was pretty neutral on this until he told Anubhav to unvote, from there the response is very towny.

    Anubhav - Covered this earlier but genuinely seems not to have realised what was happening. Read them town from this.

    cozmikrae - What have I just witnessed happen here? Was the vote change responsible for Sapph dying. Feels like this response could have been because of wolf teammates asking them to unvote? Seems out of nowhere.

    Bolded... for emphasis!
    1 person likes this post: Legacy of Smiles
    HumanDawn
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    HumanDawn
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  • poem for reference
    Life’s a theatre we enter into,
    And here’s a sneak peak to our grand preview,
    Curtains unfold quick be at the centre,
    From the sides here comes your fellow actors.
    Look at the script! Remember be genuine,
    Audience dislikes the boring or brazen,
    To tear in merry and grin in dismal,
    Stay on stage and don’t reach for the aisle.
    No, no, you have it backward,
    Welcome to an absurdist stage staged for the absurd.
    The way I'm reading Sapphiron's poem is as if he were in the point of view of one of the people he scanned. Unless there's an encrypted message as others seem to be trying to decode, it seems that there's only one player being talked about in the poem.

    If we assume he scanned Melehan Night 1 based on this, and he died on Night 3, that means he had only scanned one other person on Night 2. My guess is that the poem is about this person.

    The way it reads to me is that the curtains unfolding are the start of the game, and "quick be at the center" could mean someone jumping out to be in the spotlight. If you go back to the start of the game, you'll notice that this very easily fits Red Mones' first post. "From the sides here comes your fellow actors" could then just mean that the rest of the players entered the game following this. "Look at the script! Remember be genuine": after Red's initial post, he goes for something more serious/helpful. "Audience dislikes the boring or brazen / To tear in merry and grin in dismal" could refer to his behaviour which was neither quiet nor very agressive, while the latter could refer to the amount of emojis he uses. "Stay on stage and don’t reach for the aisle / No, no, you have it backward" could refer to how he was initially very active ("staying on stage" rather than "reaching for the aisle"), but in Day 3 he went very quiet ("reaching for the aisle" rather than "staying on stage").

    This would give me the impression that Sapphiron scanned Red Mones and with the whole acting theme going on that he is scum. HOWEVER, with this post (which took place pretty early on Day 3 as if he wanted to leave a clue to clear Red), it appears that he's hinting that he's town. Ergo concordantly vis a vis, I believe that Red Mones is town.

    Unless somebody else can scrape something from that poem or perhaps plug a different player into it that works out a little clearer.

    This post is the best analysis of the poem - I agree that Red Mones was likely the check here. It could not have been... but I town read Red Mones enough that I don't really care if it actually wasn't right now.
    1 person likes this post: Red Mones
    HumanDawn
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    Minish
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  • I'm not gonna lie, I'm hung up on BSR. The fact that I thought he should have been the counter d3 and wasn't, that Sapph originally voted him d3, that Kane has an odd connection voting for him 2 days in a row, that Silver kept pushing him but never voting for him, he was on Vro d2, and then possibly voted TGN for the towncred of not voting Sapph because scum could've just killed him at night anyways.

    But... what about BSR should have made him the counterwagon?


    I've already said a few times, but he was talked about by a lot of people pushing him who didn't seem to vote him til yesterday. And he and Sapph both seemed like potential scumbuds that Silver tried to distance from so they seemed potentially unaligned to me. I also thought he would give info on other players.
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    HumanDawn
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  • So I'm kicking myself that Sapph was still lynched even after I specifically stated that Sapph pretty much ONLY soft claims power roles when he's miffed at people who still suspect he's a "wolf" or something when he clearly isn't. 

    Seeing as I know this very well, and seeing how Sapph acted rather identically in the LoTR game, I'm going to be immediately suspicious of those who are voting for him even though they have Wintreath Werewolf experience.  Consequently, my shit list presently is as follows:  Kane, Minish, Moot, and TGN. 

    Crossing this with my calls after the first day, which was for reference:
    Vro, NyghtOwl, Melehan, Cozmikrae, Ruguo, Gerrick, Wischland, and Minish, who I initially discounted because I liked the analysis, but now I'm definitely more suspect of because being in two townie kill chains is much more suspect, though not being around for EOD is definitely a valid excuse too, so I can't say still.  Coz is also suspicious as hell still, because of the literally 3 MINUTES BEFORE THE DEADLINE unvote. 

    Vote with me if you want to cut off their necks~~~

    Vro though, while still oddly focused on killing me, did get someone to unvote Sapph, which would generally be enough to gain my trust, but I'm still unsure because he could still be a wolf coordinating with Coz, especially because he told the guy to UNVOTE rather than just vote TGN,  and just accepting a 50-50 of killing the Seer to appear less suspect.  TGN voting Sapph out of self preservation was fine at the beginning, but then keeping it after Sapph soft-not-so-soft claimed Seer is also SUPER suspect. 

    I'm not sure who we should kill right now, but I have a feeling that some people who are actually villagers might be targeting me, so I would not be opposed to a self lynch of myself to prove to them that they are in fact wrong and get them to bark up a correct tree.  Then again, the analysis in this game generally has been quite sketch, apart from that of Minish, Smiles and HumanDawn, who I believe is the replacement for ENE, and the immediate posting after being brought in really makes me think town, because if I was brought in as a wolf, I'd definitely try to PM with my other wolves first. 

    So if we have to kill me for people to do better analysis, I'm all for it, but I'd prefer if not, because analysis this game has been shit and I can't really count on the townies bringing it home rn because I'm not fully confident Minish is town.

    I really hope you aren't lynched because there isn't a case on you that I know of.

    I agree about Minish - I want to Town read the slot but something in the back of my head tells me not to. I don't recall a case from her on you and yet she argues you should have been the counterwagon and that it was strange that it wasn't when 3 out of 18 living players in Day 3 are Mafia (and technically only 2 could change the wagon outside of you even if you are scum). Maybe it would hold more merit in a smaller game, but going by the numbers, it's unlikely Mafia had a large say in saving you from being lynched Day 3. If there was a strong case, I would argue it would have merit... but there wasn't.
    HumanDawn
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    HumanDawn
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  • I'm not gonna lie, I'm hung up on BSR. The fact that I thought he should have been the counter d3 and wasn't, that Sapph originally voted him d3, that Kane has an odd connection voting for him 2 days in a row, that Silver kept pushing him but never voting for him, he was on Vro d2, and then possibly voted TGN for the towncred of not voting Sapph because scum could've just killed him at night anyways.

    But... what about BSR should have made him the counterwagon?


    I've already said a few times, but he was talked about by a lot of people pushing him who didn't seem to vote him til yesterday. And he and Sapph both seemed like potential scumbuds that Silver tried to distance from so they seemed potentially unaligned to me. I also thought he would give info on other players.

    So...? BSR is one of the less active players - there wasn't much to talk about other than acknowledging him, and players can have other suspicions in their mind that they decide to vote for over him. I'm struggling to see how that can move BSR closer to being Mafia in any way. I can't think of any examples in my head in which Silver/Ruguo tried to distance from both of them. I mean, I guess there is the potential - but that doesn't mean much on its own. I don't know BSR's meta so I can't comment much on the info giving.

    Additionally:

    Silver kept pushing him but never voting for him, he was on Vro d2, and then possibly voted TGN for the towncred of not voting Sapph because scum could've just killed him at night anyways.

    Silver was voting Vroendal to save himself, voting BSR doesn't make much sense. I can see why scum could potentially vote TGN for towncred of not voting a soft claim, but while scum can kill in the night, they have two doctors, one of which would be enough to protect Sapph and keep them alive.
    HumanDawn
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    Minish
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  • So I'm kicking myself that Sapph was still lynched even after I specifically stated that Sapph pretty much ONLY soft claims power roles when he's miffed at people who still suspect he's a "wolf" or something when he clearly isn't. 

    Seeing as I know this very well, and seeing how Sapph acted rather identically in the LoTR game, I'm going to be immediately suspicious of those who are voting for him even though they have Wintreath Werewolf experience.  Consequently, my shit list presently is as follows:  Kane, Minish, Moot, and TGN. 

    Crossing this with my calls after the first day, which was for reference:
    Vro, NyghtOwl, Melehan, Cozmikrae, Ruguo, Gerrick, Wischland, and Minish, who I initially discounted because I liked the analysis, but now I'm definitely more suspect of because being in two townie kill chains is much more suspect, though not being around for EOD is definitely a valid excuse too, so I can't say still.  Coz is also suspicious as hell still, because of the literally 3 MINUTES BEFORE THE DEADLINE unvote. 

    Vote with me if you want to cut off their necks~~~

    Vro though, while still oddly focused on killing me, did get someone to unvote Sapph, which would generally be enough to gain my trust, but I'm still unsure because he could still be a wolf coordinating with Coz, especially because he told the guy to UNVOTE rather than just vote TGN,  and just accepting a 50-50 of killing the Seer to appear less suspect.  TGN voting Sapph out of self preservation was fine at the beginning, but then keeping it after Sapph soft-not-so-soft claimed Seer is also SUPER suspect. 

    I'm not sure who we should kill right now, but I have a feeling that some people who are actually villagers might be targeting me, so I would not be opposed to a self lynch of myself to prove to them that they are in fact wrong and get them to bark up a correct tree.  Then again, the analysis in this game generally has been quite sketch, apart from that of Minish, Smiles and HumanDawn, who I believe is the replacement for ENE, and the immediate posting after being brought in really makes me think town, because if I was brought in as a wolf, I'd definitely try to PM with my other wolves first. 

    So if we have to kill me for people to do better analysis, I'm all for it, but I'd prefer if not, because analysis this game has been shit and I can't really count on the townies bringing it home rn because I'm not fully confident Minish is town.

    I really hope you aren't lynched because there isn't a case on you that I know of.

    I agree about Minish - I want to Town read the slot but something in the back of my head tells me not to. I don't recall a case from her on you and yet she argues you should have been the counterwagon and that it was strange that it wasn't when 3 out of 18 living players in Day 3 are Mafia (and technically only 2 could change the wagon outside of you even if you are scum). Maybe it would hold more merit in a smaller game, but going by the numbers, it's unlikely Mafia had a large say in saving you from being lynched Day 3. If there was a strong case, I would argue it would have merit... but there wasn't.

    I spent d3 stating the case against BSR. At the time he had posted like 5 times so there wasn't much of a case that could be had in terms of actions but there were people that kept suspecting him and not voting for him or someone like Kane who voted him 2 days in a row and then didn't vote him yesterday. The reason BSR should have been the counter yesterday is the fact that he was so talked about without anyone doing anything until that day and the thought that I had that he and Sapph were unaligned. I don't know where you got that I think mafia shifted the votes because that's not what I said at all. I think town spent time talking about BSR and then suddenly shifted again to TGN.

    Also just saw your other post before submitting this. Yes people can have other suspicions they follow but the general discussion of BSR seemed odd. You're struggling to see how mafia can easily distance by throwing light suspicion on a scumbud and never doing anything about it?

    And I laid it out yesterday how Silver was potentially distancing. It's like you're trying to shade me for stuff I've clearly explained before. But it came from Silver pushing BSR a lot but never once voting him. And Silver also continuously stating suspicion of Sapph but doing so in a way he could easily back out of later (saying he felt odd but that he needed to ISO before he could say for sure and never ISO'd him).


    Also I'm fairly certain Silver was pushing to vote BSR before Silver himself was a wagon, so it wasn't that he was just voting elsewhere to save himself. Even once the wagons were him and TGN he said he would rather vote BSR if others would too but didn't really push it that hard.
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    HumanDawn
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  • Vro though, while still oddly focused on killing me, did get someone to unvote Sapph, which would generally be enough to gain my trust, but I'm still unsure because he could still be a wolf coordinating with Coz, especially because he told the guy to UNVOTE rather than just vote TGN,  and just accepting a 50-50 of killing the Seer to appear less suspect.  TGN voting Sapph out of self preservation was fine at the beginning, but then keeping it after Sapph soft-not-so-soft claimed Seer is also SUPER suspect.

    Point of order; the telling Anubhav to unvote took it from a tie to TGN 1 vote ahead. It was Cozmik's unvote that put it into a tie, and RNGesus got Sapph killed.
    I'm still soft sus on Vro but I've grown dramatically less so after that move; if he'd told him to actively vote TGN...that probably actually wouldn't have changed my mind very much, since if TGN flipped scum I'd have considered that a bus play because of how I've been tunnelling, and if he'd flipped town I'd just be confident Vro was town.
    In any case, I'm sold on the possibility of TGN being the Armored Titan. On the one hand, if we went for a lynch on him and found out for sure, that'd be a 'waste' of a lynch, since it wouldn't actually work. On the other hand, sure would be nice to have a Sure Thing right now. Especially since I now know that, in the event Vro and TGN are linked, they'd have to be scumbuds, since Lau noted that the Seer never formed a squad and the defenders/'doctors' as y'all seem to prefer calling them aren't in contact.
    So, fuck it, Vote: TGN.
    Consistency.

    This is an interesting theory. I actually forgot that we had a power wolf like that. Even if exposed though, would we be able to do anything once we discovered their identity?
    I mean, not really, but we'd lower the odds of each other individual player being scum from 3/17 to 1/8. I like that just from a 'being less paranoid' perspective - and based on interaction with other players gives us a better sense of who their scumbuds are.
    IMO, if he's really the Armored Titan, knowing who one of the scum is for sure beats not knowing even if it's otherwise a 'waste' of a lynch.
    *bolding of the word Armored Titan done by me

    Where does it mention that the Armored Titan is the name of the Alpha Werewolf/Godfather? I can't seem to find anywhere in this thread that mentions that/makes that connection. As someone who hasn't watched Attack on Titan, I find it strange that you use this term especially since the only place before your post that the word "armour" is used is in an EoD flavor post by Laurentus that says "a Titan with thick layers of armour," so it wasn't even used in the proper noun form that you are. I can only assume that you learned this term from a PM that either you or one of your scumbuds received before the start of the game. Man, I unfortunately think you really are cursed...

    Vote: Doc

    The Armored Titan not being able to be killed until all the others die makes a lot of sense. It doesn't fit perfectly, but I can see why they would be chosen to be the unkillable Mafioso until the others die. Actually, I would argue that if the Mafia knew, they would take the opportunity to play dumb and not even mention them at all.

    The vote is too hasty. I feel like you are making a mountain out of a molehill, and you even admit that you haven't even watched the show. For me, I would have consulted somebody who knows the show more first before voting. It doesn't really work much for pressure when it's a pretty small thing.
    HumanDawn
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