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Game Over on Round 5 Day

Root Host: ☆ Princess Abigail ☆

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I can get wanting to start conversation with the other townspeople, but why in the form of just saying to bangwagon someone who didn’t have much evidence against them?

I can get wanting to start conversation with the other townspeople, but why in the form of just saying to bangwagon someone who didn’t have much evidence against them?

how else 

I can get wanting to start conversation with the other townspeople, but why in the form of just saying to bangwagon someone who didn’t have much evidence against them?

how else

How else?? Like we haven’t seen others show how else, but…
You could ask others about their stances on people, maybe try and see possible info that they gathered and discuss it? Luka, I really don’t get this reply…

I think I'm awake now, will start working on ISOing soon

I hate dead games
I get accused of LAMIST for just trying to generate discussion
We wouldnt be here w/o me

are your reads still the same? can you refresh our memory?

Please reply to this, Luka?

How can one be so obvious town yet so obviously wrong at the same time
Leesbra never pushes me as wolf here im 100% confident in that.

Those more often go together than not tbh.

Luka I'm not going to get fully read up today. Can you walk me through the events before I joined from your perspective? I want to get an idea for how you've experienced the game. Who did what, how did that influence your reads...

How can one be so obvious town yet so obviously wrong at the same time
Leesbra never pushes me as wolf here im 100% confident in that.

Those more often go together than not tbh.

Luka I'm not going to get fully read up today. Can you walk me through the events before I joined from your perspective? I want to get an idea for how you've experienced the game. Who did what, how did that influence your reads...

...how would you rate your own play this game and why?

ISO is a butt to do so I'll just reread thread and make comments on quotes that recatch my attention as I go.

Quote 1: Unsure if I should feel honored, or insulted by this attention! If you are implying that I'm already really wolfy, then you should vote me though. And Idk how informative votes on me will rlly be? I tend to attract both town and mafia voting me, usually

Neither? Luka's mini-push had put you as a front and center focal point early in the game so seeing how people react to that is what I'll claim my reads are based on but in reality since I don't know meta behind most of the players here I'll probably just be going off vibes today while I get a sense of everybody.

For example, Luka seemed to be intentionally hard town reading people on the fly for nothing as a manner of reading their reactions. The initial read is irrelevant and the true read lies in how they respond to being town read. For me this is town points to Luka because it provides a better read than gauging people off a hard push/suggested wagon (while they also did that it was more jokey/less follow through) which would be aimed at just stirring turmoil.

This post comes off as Numbers being slightly annoyed by Luka townlocking certain people, but also trying to keep his reads honest in case Luka became a point of discussion. I don't think scum Numbers gets out of his way to townread Luka here.

Luka is doing his best Abbi impression and trying to post cap in 3 hours

I mean, i’m probably gonna just reach post min and leave for the day. I like talking but it’d be better if I don’t.

You cannot look at me and tell me they aren’t lock vil like cmon

A: Yes, you used the mention right. B: This is my second werewolf game, my first was Werewolf 30 (AKA Werewolf XXX).?

It means essentially before game. Abigail is the only one to really have before game posts.

Thanks on both counts. I just took a look at that game, and you were a wolf. Cool beans, that should prove useful. FYI: I'd suggest anticipating a considerably higher activity level than that game was -- it ended on page 6. Even at a 75 post cap, that's not happening here.

There is also the fact that there wasn’t really a post minimum last game, so… that made it short. Also if you’re thinking i’m good at seeing potential suspects for a wolf, I dunno what to say to you.

Luka is doing his best Abbi impression and trying to post cap in 3 hours

I mean, i’m probably gonna just reach post min and leave for the day. I like talking but it’d be better if I don’t.

Hello! I am JaggedJimmyJay. I am known for hunting mafia harder than your dad, compiling Champs stats, and recording bad karaoke.

It'd be super if anyone could provide a quick rundown of who knows who in this game, because that can go a long way in assessing both interactions and the validity of arguments made (e.g., with meta reads).

I don't know anyone well, so on my own I'll be operating purely at face value.

At face value, I like the cut of Luka's jib. I acknowledge this read is a somewhat shallow "vibe check", but whatever it's a starting point. Separating the game immediately into binary groups (town/mafia) as they have started to do is the right management of thread momentum.

Quote 1: I sadly also townread that post >.> But lock vil? Omg, no
Quote 2: A game with.. with.. with.. 6 pages of max 15 posts.. I'd lose it. I plan on posting more then that per day phase ;-; (using the final hour, I am well aware of the post cap)
Quote 3: Pls don't go >.< Any posts can help @Leesbra So if you like talking then do so! It also isn't rlly helpful to only post 10 times. How can we solve you? What if you'd have a great insight?
Quote 4: Ohhhh so that's where I recognize you from! I recognized your name, but couldn't place where. That makes you quite the celebrity tho so I feel so honored that I get to play with you
Quote 5: So first point about this quote; it kinda pings me. Idk why. But it does. Probably the final sentence?
Also I know: Sam (he is my best friend), Luka, Callahan (played with both at least 15 times), ExLight, Glorious Bob (played with both at least once), and I know you exist! Other then that, I don't think I know anyone but my memory is likeeee totally bad

1. Omg yes
2. Me fr
3. LAMIST
4. Pocketing
5. Townie

Why is cait town telling this is rigged

Just quoted here cuz I found funny (not funny) how you complained about people LAMIST-ing you and you doing it to Cait in the most dry way possible.
What does LAMIST even mean.

If Leesbra is truly in their second game ever, that general reference to early solving being spooky is recognizable and vaguely town. That begs the question: is it truly your second game @Leesbra? I don't really know anyone here, and I note a very low post count, so it seems like a first game on Wintreath at least? Please let me know where you played, thanks. If it was here, lemme know the game.

Hopefully I used the mention correctly.

Townie post, but I thought I had quoted another message (the one where JJJ mentions that a second time player would get hesitant to make reads). I'm curious about the skepticism, why would Leesbra be lying about it?

Hi! Just want to stop in!

I'm Callahan : )

I'll be rereading what I missed, but excited to play with you all! Already at 10 pages so, the game is pretty active, which is good!

That was a townie entry but the game being active part aged like milk, lol. In retrospect most of it was Cait and Luka butting heads ig.

I think the multiquotes get my quotes out of order and I wanna cry

After reading on earlier posts from Exlight, they really don’t tell wolf to me. So I feel like it would still be Luka if we’re going off of the list Numbers gave…

…though, there might be a chance Numbers used it as a throw-off to get more townmen out?

What does LAMIST even mean.

Look At Me I'm So Towny! basically doing a thing a certain way that looks like you're being showy with how towny it is.

So in the example you quoted Luka was saying that Cait's appeal to Leesbra to keep posting was over the top "look at how much I want to solve Leesbra".

I do think there's some validity to interpreting Leesbra's Steve Buscemi post as towny. I can't speak to Luka's rationale, and they ought to expand on what led them to that viewpoint.

I'll expand on my impression. I am content to believe that this is Leesbra's second game ever. For such a new player, there is often a natural resistance to or fear of the mere concept of someone making reads (let alone confident reads) based on game-entry content. The nerves inherent to a new player, including or especially a new town player, tend to make them more disinclined to make reads like that. They're slow, they're confused, and they're turbulent. It's perfectly okay to be those things, and it would lend itself to a mindset like like one Leesbra expressed: the way some people are already theorizing about who is a werewolf is a bit concerning.

This can be taken with a fair grain of salt since the game is so young, and it's not a thoroughly developed impression. But I have seen this kind of thing before from brand new town players, and they have often responded that way to me for engaging straightaway in a similar manner to Luka's opening to this game.

Okay, after rereading, I think the only thing that actually stood out to me was JJJ. I just feel like they are doing too much. I'm unsure if it's just how they play naturally but there is a fine line between "Look at me! I'm so townie and progressive!" and "I'm overcompensating because I'm scum and I want to be quickly town read." It's the beginning of the game, and they are already thinking too deeply about certain matters such as this post above. The middle paragraph specifically, like I'm reading this and all I'm thinking is what is the point of this? Why are you analyzing if it's this person's second game or not, and what traits they should have? It's just too much for no reason, and I'm unsure if it's playstyle or just you feel the need to overcompensate for something. And then their third paragraph is just completely discrediting themselves? I don't know what I'm supposed to do with this post. What is the intent behind this, because all I see is just a pile of words that actually have no direction behind them, especially after you accept that your post can be taken with a grain of salt?

I feel like some of the stuff people here have said or done feels extreme, to say the least. An example being Luka supposedly locking in me being town after 3 messages. I don’t really get that… so I feel like it might either be that these people are either just spitballing to try and make it seem like they can tell when they might just be wolf… or they really are that smart, and i’m just dumb. Not sure who out of these people to vote, but some of yall act real weird…

This seems genuine. Townie?
I'm slightly annoyed by the lack of pressure on people to explain why they're townreading him instead of just sitting and being "okay! guess you guys are just scary!"

I do think there's some validity to interpreting Leesbra's Steve Buscemi post as towny. I can't speak to Luka's rationale, and they ought to expand on what led them to that viewpoint.

I'll expand on my impression. I am content to believe that this is Leesbra's second game ever. For such a new player, there is often a natural resistance to or fear of the mere concept of someone making reads (let alone confident reads) based on game-entry content. The nerves inherent to a new player, including or especially a new town player, tend to make them more disinclined to make reads like that. They're slow, they're confused, and they're turbulent. It's perfectly okay to be those things, and it would lend itself to a mindset like like one Leesbra expressed: the way some people are already theorizing about who is a werewolf is a bit concerning.

This can be taken with a fair grain of salt since the game is so young, and it's not a thoroughly developed impression. But I have seen this kind of thing before from brand new town players, and they have often responded that way to me for engaging straightaway in a similar manner to Luka's opening to this game.

Okay, after rereading, I think the only thing that actually stood out to me was JJJ. I just feel like they are doing too much. I'm unsure if it's just how they play naturally but there is a fine line between "Look at me! I'm so townie and progressive!" and "I'm overcompensating because I'm scum and I want to be quickly town read." It's the beginning of the game, and they are already thinking too deeply about certain matters such as this post above. The middle paragraph specifically, like I'm reading this and all I'm thinking is what is the point of this? Why are you analyzing if it's this person's second game or not, and what traits they should have? It's just too much for no reason, and I'm unsure if it's playstyle or just you feel the need to overcompensate for something. And then their third paragraph is just completely discrediting themselves? I don't know what I'm supposed to do with this post. What is the intent behind this, because all I see is just a pile of words that actually have no direction behind them, especially after you accept that your post can be taken with a grain of salt?

Vote: JaggedJimmyJay

This is a very uncharitable interpretation of what I had to say.

First of all, reducing a player's effort to explain a thought process clearly to "look at me I'm so townie and progressive" is incredibly unfair. You've taken a post where I had quite a lot to say, and you have twisted it in whatever manner you can to portray it as me saying nothing. Time to color code.

Green: You have referenced a portion of my post where I described why "Leesbra's second game" it is important to me and asked me why I brought up Leesbra's second game. The answer to that question is in the post. Players often fall into particular archetypes when they are brand new to the game, and I described what I have often observed from players who are brand new to the game. That is absolutely relevant to interpreting Leesbra's alignment, and I described precisely why I felt that way.

Suggesting my commentary is "nothing" or "pointless" or "overcompensating" without actually engaging with any of it is disingenuous. I don't like that.

Orange: Absolutely no thanks. I provided the direction earlier in the post (and in the post that preceded it on the same topic): here's why I think there's a valid reason to town read Leesbra. That is a direction. You are quoting a post that expresses that direction. It's right there. And in that third paragraph, I acknowledged that it's not a super confident read, and that I am not certain. That's called being responsible with a take. And yet even still, in the very same third paragraph, I reiterated my viewpoint. I have often seen brand new town players do what Leesbra did.

Red: This extends from the orange bit, really, but it drives home why I don't like this so much. You would have to ignore the words in the post to come to this conclusion about it. Of course I accept that my read can be taken with a grain of salt, and I should. Anyone that doesn't allow for that in a read they've made on someone they've never played with before is being a little ridiculous.

I struggle to believe that you read my post in good faith and came to those conclusions. It looks like you decided what your read on me was and then formulated an argument to justify it.

Vote: callahan

Yeah, this doesn't make sense. New players has to fall into a certain player archtype? That just seems controlling. Like you must play like this because you are new is all what I'm hearing.
Just because you don't like me saying you are overcompensating doesn't change the fact you are? Like you are literally color coding? I don't understand why you post something but you aren't even confident in it, and even suggest the fact people can take it for a grain of salt? Don't post something if your not confident in it? You're going to waste everybody's time. It just seems like you are blabbering for no reason even more now. You speak about a valid reason to town read Leesbra, but then you are like take it for a grain of salt? LOL? I am in no way ignoring your words at all, I'm left wondering what is the point of your post because I still do not see one. Like I'm looking, I really am. Me struggling to read your post in good faith is such a wack concept, I'm pointing out that you are overcompensating, obviously have no confidence in what you are saying, and just yapping to yap?

Yeah, this doesn't make sense. New players has to fall into a certain player archtype? That just seems controlling. Like you must play like this because you are new is all what I'm hearing.

Just because you don't like me saying you are overcompensating doesn't change the fact you are? Like you are literally color coding? I don't understand why you post something but you aren't even confident in it, and even suggest the fact people can take it for a grain of salt? Don't post something if your not confident in it? You're going to waste everybody's time. It just seems like you are blabbering for no reason even more now. You speak about a valid reason to town read Leesbra, but then you are like take it for a grain of salt? LOL? I am in no way ignoring your words at all, I'm left wondering what is the point of your post because I still do not see one. Like I'm looking, I really am. Me struggling to read your post in good faith is such a wack concept, I'm pointing out that you are overcompensating, obviously have no confidence in what you are saying, and just yapping to yap?

Green: Excuse me, but what? I didn't say anything about "has to fall into an archetype". I cannot understand how that could interpreted as "controlling". I feel like you are just tacking adjectives to your assessment.

Leesbra exhibited a behavior that I have seen before from new players with town roles. That's the read. I will expand, if the missing link is "I have seen this far less if ever from new players who are mafia".

Orange: Color coding is a way to reference posts effectively, and it is even a personal meme that Caitlin requested earlier. You read the game. I don't believe these are real thoughts. You are essentially suggesting that there is no reason a person should express a thought if they don't have total confidence that it is the correct thought. That is nonsense.

Callahan x JJJ has some interesting interactions I had missed the a few times. Since both are in the PoE I think these are particularly interesting. I can actually see both points of view and it makes me think this is likely TvT. If I had to pick one of these to be scum I'd probably implode because I keep going back and forth on who's slightly more scummy.
I do think JJJ's points on Leesbra are fair and it's a slot that requires more analysis because beginners are usually fairly hard to read. I do wish JJJ had taken a more noticeable stance on the more experienced players though. And I don't think Callahan throws a punch scumreading JJJ outta nowhere if they didn't want to get a convo going. It does feel like that was something that caught their attention.
On the other hand I feel like her arguments on him are weak and somewhat put words in his mouth, which raised a few red flags. JJJ's style of posting here also reminds me a bit of the couple town games I seen him play.

Overall I think these mixed signals both point to these slots being town, which makes it so the only remaining slot that remains a question mark to me to be Serif?

Hey everyone. EOD right?
I can't point to any singular post but Luka hasn't come across well to me once this game. Between myself and the person Luka is voting, I'd much rather vote Luka.
Vote: Luka
I'll hang around for now, hopefully until EoD but I might have to leave before then.
Anyone else here?

Oh good afternoon ExLight

My slot looked like shit D1 lmfao I can see why Cait was underwhelmed by me popping back in
I had no input in the Calla x JJJ at the time 

Oh good afternoon ExLight

Hi, good afternoon!
Unfortunately I feel like you're at the bottom of my readslists, care to bounce some ideas off with me?