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Game Over on Round 5 Day

Root Host: ☆ Princess Abigail ☆

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While I quite like Serif's vibe and would definitely play with them again, I also have to consider that they haven't... given a read. On anyone. At least I don't remember one. I'd verify with an ISO, but I can't be digging around the thread at work.

Hello all good afternoon. Sorry, I've been very busy but I'm here now.

While I quite like Serif's vibe and would definitely play with them again, I also have to consider that they haven't... given a read. On anyone. At least I don't remember one. I'd verify with an ISO, but I can't be digging around the thread at work.

I've given some reads but it's been quite awkward for me overall. I replaced in day 2, shown up in day 3 for there to be a redcheck, and well, now its day 4. or day 3? My entire mental clock has been thrown off.

I think my only reads, being on icet and Caitlin, have been less than ideal, first game reads and all.
Nice to meet you Sugar Moon.

Does anyone have a list of why the consensus town are consensus? I get the feeling I've fallen behind so it'd be much help.

Does anyone have a list of why the consensus town are consensus? I get the feeling I've fallen behind so it'd be much help.

There seems to be some amount of disagreement about this, so the "consensus" is a bit unclear. I can give you some of my impressions though.

Caitlin is near-confirmed town mechanically.
Leesbra has seemed like a very authentically new town player and seems like a bad fit with Numbers.
ExLight had at least one moment in which they and Numbers didn't seem like a great fit together. I talked about that here: https://wintreath.com/forums/index.php?topic=8129.msg173867#msg173867

I thought that would hyperlink. Here:

clicky

Luka was my tinfoil, and I could be convinced in that direction.

I distance as scum
I havent commented on numbers once which, is sus in its own right; but doesnt allgin with my scum meta

Perhaps so, though that isn't exactly a self-endorsement that I am going to take to the bank. To even have a clearly defined "scum meta" means you basically lose the moment you rand scum. There has to be some kind of variation, and I suspect that applies to someone like yourself that at least at times in this game has played with effort and confidence.

I have a very well defined scum meta 

I'll reply to your things tomorrow JJJ, but I'm busy rn

I suppose I'll unvote rn

Vote: Unvote

Ok so I've got about 30 hours till EoD that should be enough. So far I've only read about 200-250 posts I know my early susses were Luka and ExLight but I'm sure that would have changed by this point in the game. I'll try to dig up why if anyone is interested (but remember those would be stale reads by now and I'm going to probably change them as I catch up).

Townreads are Cait, JJJ and Leesbra (I am more confident in these than in the scumreads for obvious reasons).

I'd appreciate if you could expand on what has led you to any or all of the reads you express here -- particularly the town reads (if I am right to interpret that those are more current).

It is my experience that my early townreads are more worth hanging on to because they tend to be more accurate than my early scumreads. I'll be expanding in a separate post for each player because nobody wants to read a huge quote wall (least of all me).


ExLight

Starting here because I've actually changed my read.

uh catching up with the thread and I'm seeing some things got a bit heated

will head to bed now and after I wake up I'll reread it a bit more carefully to make some reads and take a stance on the situation

This is the post that initially pinged me from ExLight. It says literally nothing of value, and is that typical "I am totally active and reading and will give content I promise" post wolves like to make.

However, there are two unpairing posts that you've missed in your ExLight/Numbers iso:

Some of the squad here has indicated town reading ExLight. I'd appreciate hearing more about why that is. @Caitlinuwu @Luka I believe each of you apply.

Scum would’ve voted cait to get early town cred from me

I feel like that's massively untrue of any experienced player. You might get lucky on inexperienced scum, but more likely would just end up throwing suspicion at somebody that just thought you were clowning and rolled with it.

Im not saying town wouldnt have voted; I think its more likely for a town to not vote than a scum to not vote is what im saying

I think the reasoning is decent but a bit fallacious.

If someone had voted Cait to try giving it some momentum then it be seen as a scummy pushing for an early wagon.

But while voting can be scummy, abstaining from it isn't necessarily townie.

Here Numbers is needlessly inserting himself into a conversation between you and Luka to push back against Luka's reason for townreading ExLight. As a wolf, you just let the loltown have their silly D1 townread on your buddy, unless you intend to hard bus.

Note that this is immediately also a reason why my initial scumlean on Luka might be off too. I will come back to this but I'm saving Luka for last.

BobbyMac isn't a hard town read but when you're that glorious you get to be green anyway. While this might not be Mac that I know from hydra games I feel like it's in line for Bob's presence in London adventure so I feel like that is NAI Bob persona vs how Mac just normally plays. I talked about why Luka had town points before and Ex just feels like he does whenever I rope him into games and he's half paying attention which I would attribute to lower pressure town!Ex vs scum!Ex. Serif, T, and Jamie are replacement null for now. Callahan I didn't really have issue with in terms of stances, as said before the over the top bit just gives me pause because I don't have meta experience there. On the other side of that coin is JJJ who I feel is performative but I'm paused from orange sherberting here because I feel like it's NAI performance. Like they might just be a theater kid and love the showman aspect. Leesbra gets to be orange because I reviewed their other game and do not feel they were nearly as timid. Could be dichotomy of alignments but could also just be them attempting to course correct since they were caught wolf day 2. Would rather see more out of the slot than see them go over though. Cait gets to be orange because the "why did you suddenly show up?" question just doesn't sit well with me. The only thing it does for a town!Cait is set up the argument that Ex was creeping in thread just waiting for somebody to mention him but that's like a horrible argument from a town perspective but would be an easy thing for a wolf to pounce on. I don't really expect a champs player to go for that low of fruit but also it just sticks out like a sore thumb.

It's quite clear in hindsight that Cait is someone Numbers wanted dead. Now, it's possible that this is a very blatant chainsaw defense, but much more likely that Numbers is whiteknighting ExLight here. This post also negates the idea of the previous one being a setup to hard bus.

So ExLight is most likely town.

I think my only reads, being on icet and Caitlin, have been less than ideal, first game reads and all.
Nice to meet you Sugar Moon.

These make sense based on D2 but I'm surprised you seem to not consider your D1 reads

Hi Sugar Moon!

to be fair in a setup this small I don't think scum pushes for a bus, so they would likely try to shift attention away from their scumbuds 

Cait

I'm not going to dig up quotes for this, being roleblocked by flipped scum is plenty clearing. The previous post is too. What I initially townread from Cait was that in the one scum game of hers I spectated her early game posts felt a little forced cheerful whereas the ones in this game did not.


JJJ

I do think there's some validity to interpreting Leesbra's Steve Buscemi post as towny. I can't speak to Luka's rationale, and they ought to expand on what led them to that viewpoint.

I'll expand on my impression. I am content to believe that this is Leesbra's second game ever. For such a new player, there is often a natural resistance to or fear of the mere concept of someone making reads (let alone confident reads) based on game-entry content. The nerves inherent to a new player, including or especially a new town player, tend to make them more disinclined to make reads like that. They're slow, they're confused, and they're turbulent. It's perfectly okay to be those things, and it would lend itself to a mindset like like one Leesbra expressed: the way some people are already theorizing about who is a werewolf is a bit concerning.

This can be taken with a fair grain of salt since the game is so young, and it's not a thoroughly developed impression. But I have seen this kind of thing before from brand new town players, and they have often responded that way to me for engaging straightaway in a similar manner to Luka's opening to this game.

Okay, after rereading, I think the only thing that actually stood out to me was JJJ. I just feel like they are doing too much. I'm unsure if it's just how they play naturally but there is a fine line between "Look at me! I'm so townie and progressive!" and "I'm overcompensating because I'm scum and I want to be quickly town read." It's the beginning of the game, and they are already thinking too deeply about certain matters such as this post above. The middle paragraph specifically, like I'm reading this and all I'm thinking is what is the point of this? Why are you analyzing if it's this person's second game or not, and what traits they should have? It's just too much for no reason, and I'm unsure if it's playstyle or just you feel the need to overcompensate for something. And then their third paragraph is just completely discrediting themselves? I don't know what I'm supposed to do with this post. What is the intent behind this, because all I see is just a pile of words that actually have no direction behind them, especially after you accept that your post can be taken with a grain of salt?

Vote: JaggedJimmyJay

The polemic that started with these posts seemed obviously v/v to me. For Callahan (and it's a pity I subbed into a slot I had a reason to townread) it made no sense to attack JJJ strongly and then just let that read sit when he gave such a delightful overly defensive OMGUS response. A wolf should have pounced on that. For JJJ's part I expect a wolf with his experience to handle the situation more tactfully. Throwing a hurtful expression like "you're not reading me in good faith" into someone's face never ends well, especially not when they're town; unless there is some bad blood between the players, town simply has no motive to act with malice, ever. I do not think JJJ is the type of wolf player who purposely makes townies feel bad, more likely is that he is someone who takes great care to communicate clearly and cannot wrap his head around how someone uninformed could still fail to understand what he's trying to say. Which means JJJ had no idea of Callahan's alignment which means he's town.

And as an aside, saying this to a mafia player is hardly less hurtful. Misreading a town's posts to get them eliminated is literally their job in the game, and without players willing to do it our hobby is dead. 

Leesbra

Luka is doing his best Abbi impression and trying to post cap in 3 hours

I mean, i’m probably gonna just reach post min and leave for the day. I like talking but it’d be better if I don’t.

Hey i’m back because I still haven’t reached post min. Abigail begged me not to go quiet so here the fuck I am

This may be naive but I usually townread it when a player voluntarily gives up thread control. A slanking wolf will always still give the appearance that they're "trying".  Leesbra has a "I don't know why I'm even here" attitude I'm convinced he's just an utterly lost town.


Also:

Hi! Just want to stop in!

I'm Callahan : )

I'll be rereading what I missed, but excited to play with you all! Already at 10 pages so, the game is pretty active, which is good!

Hello there Callahan. Usually I wouldn’t be this active, but with a post minimum and whatever rule Caitlin was talking about, I kinda have to.
Either way welcome on.

Hello there as well, bit confused about what's wrong with the post minimum since all you have to do is post 10 times, which you can just make 10 comments on what's happening, or am I missing something?

Also thank you for welcoming me! ^.^

The minimum is fine, though apparently that wasn’t the ONLY low posting rule… like I said. So… i’m here. Unsure of who to vote for werewolf and clearly outleagued by 98% of the people here.

If the low posters out number the high posters we can always turn the tables on them. But also I'm pretty sure Cait is talking more about your content than your number. You did make that whole "gonna hit the minimum and dip on the rest of day" comment.

This is pocketing.

Luka

68 posts before I don’t have to play a game
We have an objective

Contrast this with Leesbra's posts about the posting above. You know who rushes to the postcap with a bunch of solvy posts? Scum.

I do want to test the voting system though and I will

Vote: Michi

to do so
sup buddy been a while

I have TMI they’re town don’t

Haha this is the type of joke I just see from mafia more than from town.


Now for the next part you need to look at a few quotes together:

Read List:

Town Lean:
- Ex
- Leesbra

Null but let’s pretend like scum lean:
- Cait

So Luka starts off townleaning Leesbra's opening post (below, notice time stamps). ExLight is also a townlean.

How do you do, fellow people?

Spoiler

Second game of Werewolf i’ve been in, first was… a bit chaotic to say. Wanting things to go well, though the way SOME people *cough cough* are theorizing about who is Werewolf or not already is a bit concerning.

From Florida, gremlin of a man,

Leesbra.

Townie

The fucking speed of you is terrifying

Can you ask what’s townie about it

I want to, but at the same time it’s like you probably have my address from that post

Genuinely you’re lock villager from 3 posts congrsts

(excessively large image spoilered by me btw) The bolded also pinged me because why not just explain instead of asking this? Looks lamist to me.

Leesbra / GoldenOne town

ExLight town lean

Caitlin null

The two paranoia posts from Leesbra have him move up to locktown, leaving ExLight behind.

My legacy after I get yeeted d1 for tmi: Leesbra town

Ex is town too by the way

...and here's my problem: ExLight is suddenly elevated back to equal footing with Leesbra even though he hasn't posted during this interval. That's not a real progression.

So that's why I scumread Luka. However, remember that Numbers undermined his townreading of ExLight (in the ExLight post above). Is Numbers the kind of wolf to see a partner make some dodgy reasoning and then quickly point it out himself? Or is it more likely that I'm wrong? Additionally, this post is nagging me:

Numbers isn’t mafia with cait by the way

Is this tmi or the type of post you don't make so you don't accidentally shut yourself out of being able to push Cait after your buddy dies?

Would like input. Be back in ~12.