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Events in the Lazarus coup move apace, and has now become an invasion. Earlier today, what had already been suspected was confirmed: The New Pacific Order, the government of The Pacific, is behind the coup and intends to set up a sister organization in Lazarus. The New Pacific is best known for having had an ironclad grip over The Pacific for the past eleven years, and there is no doubt in my mind that if they succeed Lazarus will fall prey to a similar fate.

I feel that as a treaty ally of the legitimate government of Lazarus and a strong proponent of the sovereignty of regions, we need to make a strong and lasting statement in response. The NPO didn't merely support this coup, they masterminded it. While Wintreath has no diplomatic ties with the NPO and there is no significant action we can take to harm them by ourselves, I would like to propose something that is unprecedented in our region: I would like to consider banning Wintreans from Citizenship in both the New Pacific Order and their Lazarus puppet state, the New Lazarene Order. My hope is that other regions, disgusted by this outright invasion, will follow our lead and together we can make some impact in support of the legitimate government and community of Lazarus. Only strong action taken by a number of regions will have an impact on their regime long-term.

I've no clue if this is something that will have a lot of support or one that will be controversial. It's arguable that membership in those organizations already constitutes treason, bit I felt felt it most proper to have this discussion and craft a relevant law if we are to proceed. I would appreciate any input and thoughts.

Normally I wouldn't support something like this, however their actions are deplorable.

I see no reason why this would be a bad idea. Any conscientious Wintrean citizen who is also a citizen of the Pacific should seriously consider who they would support in these events.

I don't see any issues with this; the NPO clearly orchestrated the coup of a sinker.

Would someone care to draft the legislation, or would you guys rather I wrote something up?

I bid caution. At best, we'll show that we're against them by taking a rather ceremonial stand, and at worst, we'll be embarrassing ourselves.

I think we should explore more impactful alternatives, though I know this to be incredibly difficult.

EDIT: To add to that, this isn't even really something we can completely enforce.

As long as citizens who CTE and by sheer chance resurrect in Lazarus are given a fair chance to move out of Lazarus before treason and other things are considered, I'm fine with this.

As long as citizens who CTE and by sheer chance resurrect in Lazarus are given a fair chance to move out of Lazarus before treason and other things are considered, I'm fine with this.

Having a nation in the regions would not violate the proposed law...to violate the law, one would have to register on their off-site forum and apply for Citizenship. Just wanted to clear that up.

As long as citizens who CTE and by sheer chance resurrect in Lazarus are given a fair chance to move out of Lazarus before treason and other things are considered, I'm fine with this.

Having a nation in the regions would not violate the proposed law...to violate the law, one would have to register on their off-site forum and apply for Citizenship. Just wanted to clear that up.

How would this be enforced?

As long as citizens who CTE and by sheer chance resurrect in Lazarus are given a fair chance to move out of Lazarus before treason and other things are considered, I'm fine with this.

Having a nation in the regions would not violate the proposed law...to violate the law, one would have to register on their off-site forum and apply for Citizenship. Just wanted to clear that up.

How would this be enforced?

I think mainly it'd just be stalking said forums and seeing if any Wintreatheans join. 

As long as citizens who CTE and by sheer chance resurrect in Lazarus are given a fair chance to move out of Lazarus before treason and other things are considered, I'm fine with this.

Having a nation in the regions would not violate the proposed law...to violate the law, one would have to register on their off-site forum and apply for Citizenship. Just wanted to clear that up.

How would this be enforced?

I think mainly it'd just be stalking said forums and seeing if any Wintreatheans join. 

Thus violating our own law.

In any event, if Wintreatheans register there under different names, we'd never even know it.

As long as citizens who CTE and by sheer chance resurrect in Lazarus are given a fair chance to move out of Lazarus before treason and other things are considered, I'm fine with this.

Having a nation in the regions would not violate the proposed law...to violate the law, one would have to register on their off-site forum and apply for Citizenship. Just wanted to clear that up.

How would this be enforced?

I think mainly it'd just be stalking said forums and seeing if any Wintreatheans join. 

Thus violating our own law.

In any event, if Wintreatheans register there under different names, we'd never even know it.

How so?  As Mooty said, "Having a nation in the regions would not violate the proposed law"

Stalking a messageboard doesn't necessarily mean joining it to be able to stalk it.  It'd only be a violation if it was joined. 

And it'll get back to us in some way.  They'll either slip up in chat and it'll come back to us (it always does), or some other slip up will happen to where we'll find out that it's someone from here.

Fair point about not having to join said forums.

Oh, I don't know. I can be pretty convincing when I'm trying to pretend to be someone else, and trying to evade suspicion while working undercover. For instance passing info along mainly through PM. We start declaring laws like these, people will just adapt to it and make organisations like the NPO alter their strategy to make sure we see nothing of their plans.

If we go down this path, we'll be wasting time stalking forums when that time could more productively be spent planning wide-scale military solutions involving other GCRs.

In short, I see no point to this beyond providing moral support for the natives of Lazarus.

Fair point about not having to join said forums.

Oh, I don't know. I can be pretty convincing when I'm trying to pretend to be someone else, and trying to evade suspicion while working undercover. For instance passing info along mainly through PM. We start declaring laws like these, people will just adapt to it and make organisations like the NPO alter their strategy to make sure we see nothing of their plans.

If we go down this path, we'll be wasting time stalking forums when that time could more productively be spent planning wide-scale military solutions involving other GCRs.

In short, I see no point to this beyond providing moral support for the natives of Lazarus.

I don't know.  I mean in other regions on NS, I could see to where people would adapt to such rules if they were made...but since I don't foresee a great deal of Wintreatheans joining what's basically considered an enemy region/messageboard, I think this is basically just saying that if you do and we find out, there'll be consequences.  And sure, they may stick to PMs, and that's entirely up to them if they wish to join said region and engage in secrecy to that degree.  What is being said, however, is that by joining said region, you're basically renouncing your citizenship here.  Rather than having to keep up a facade and trying to act as if you're loyal to Wintreath, you might as well come out and say that you're leaving for good...because the moment we find out that you joined that invader region, you're going to be kicked out anyways.

That, and basically people tend know that as much as this is a second-chance home, Wintreath is a Defender region.  So an anti-invader stance is not that unheard of especially when they're invading an ally region. And telling people that there'll be consequences in some way for joining an invader region is essentially the same as XKI telling people that they'll get punished if they're caught joining something like The Black Riders or Lone Wolf.

Following that logic, it would then be best to declare membership in ANY raiding organisation illegal if you wish to maintain citizenship here, not just the NPO or Lazarus.