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You have now been designated as the spokeperson for XKI. A request: even if you don't want to vote, can you comment on how this day has proceeded and what your general vibes from everyone are as to their alignment? It would be awesome if all XKIers can do this, as well.

Oh no, responsibility. How am I supposed to slack off now?

But sure, I'll share some of my general impressions of the day. All I ask is that you remember I've never played with most of you before, so if I'm calling out something as suspicious when it, in reality, is normal for someone, please excuse my ignorance. Also, I'm going to refer to everyone with forum names to avoid any errors in identifying people.

So initially, I though Laurentus and Michi were suspicious for their near-immediate votes, but I've come to realize that's pretty normal, so I'm not too worried about it anymore. I'm inclined to think Lau is a good guy because of posts like this one:

Not quite yet. Why are you town-reading me? What have I done that has been sufficiently pro-town?

I feel like a wolf would just accept anything that suggested they were a good guy rather than questioning it. Could be some reverse psychology, but I'm inclined to think not.

Gerrick also stood out to me for kinda randomly voting for Flying Eagles, and then not really making any further attempts to investigate. Possibly an attempt to start a bandwagon then fade away to avoid attention?

Finally Princess Hapi struck me as odd. I feel like they made a lot of fluff posts, with some banal comment or LoTR reference, without actually making any attempt to gain more insight into other's thoughts. Felt like an attempt to give the appearance of activity without actually doing anything helpful.

Thank God, finally there is a post that seems overwhelmingly townie. I like your progression and rationale for your reads here. You are going to be a dangerous Wolf if you rolled that for this game.

Yeah, Doc's vote for Hapi was about exactly this. Hapi is really random in these games, and even though I've only played one game with her, I think spotting her Wolf meta is going to be damn difficult because of said randomness. We'd probably need a mechanical clear of some kind to eliminate suspicion from Hapi as a result.

I'll let Gerrick defend himself, but I am going to vehemently oppose literally any situation where he has a majority. If you are puzzled about this, I invite you to read some of the games he's played in. That's not to say that he's going to be out of my PoE indefinitely, but voting him off this early is most likely not going to be in town's best interest if he is also Town.

Hmm. @Doc or anyone else really who can recall a lot of book/movie references for LOTR, which characters has Hapi been referencing so far?

@turtle voted me and I don't want the mods to lynch me so

Vote turtle

Hmm. Doc or anyone else really who can recall a lot of book/movie references for LOTR, which characters has Hapi been referencing so far?

Gentlemen, we do not stop 'til nightfall.

Said by Aragorn, a member of the Fellowship.

Dying D1 to a random lynch as doctor is also a bad idea  but if by my death I can protect you than you will have my sword.

*draws sword*

Said by Aragorn.

What does your heart tell you?

Said again by Aragorn.

"But I am the real strider, fortunately. My actions may cause chaos but my heart still stands with Frodo*.
FOR FRODO!
...not idly so the leaves of Lorein fall."
And, unsurprisingly once again said by Aragorn.

Hinting at information gained during night phases is allowed, revealing information is not. Both revealing and hinting roles is not allowed.

But as this is a thing (though it was a post that might have been missed rather than a rule), either Hapi messed up or is very purposefully misleading us. I recommend in either case we completely ignore it, if only for the possibility of keeping the integrity of the game.

The role of Aragorn doesn’t suggest anything beyond a townie role though, so not entirely a rule breach

Hmm, seems she's soft-claiming Aragorn as her character, but this doesn't reveal much about specific abilities associated with it.

Would be a weird scum tactic to soft-claim it, because there is almost definitely an Aragorn somewhere, and it is likely associated with town. Counter-claims would be interesting.

If we do have something like a role cop, Hapi might not be a bad scan choice in the night.

Hmm, seems she's soft-claiming Aragorn as her character, but this doesn't reveal much about specific abilities associated with it.

Would be a weird scum tactic to soft-claim it, because there is almost definitely an Aragorn somewhere, and it is likely associated with town. Counter-claims would be interesting.

If we do have something like a role cop, Hapi might not be a bad scan choice in the night.

Tbh Lau, I strongly disagree I think Hapi would be one of the worst scan choices for several reasons:
a) This is such a Hapi thing to do to hint at her own role or information (she's even mentioned that she likes to do that in a previous game) that really I have no doubt of its truth.
b) I don't think scum would allow her to draw this much attention to herself in the fear that she would be checked.
c) There could possibly be roles that allow for messing with the results of a check and since she's a more obvious target for checks now I consider that any results may be purposefully screwed with as the result of prediction.
d) Lastly, ngl Hapi is pretty low on my list of highest susses right now anyway, I think far more could be gained in terms of information from so many other people.

I'm a little surprised you would say something like that. It makes me feel that you're subtly deflecting from yourself. I am aware that I've said you were deflecting as a wolf in the past, but my point still stands here and now. :p

I assume you mean that I'm deflecting because of my higher-than-average likelihood of being scanned N1? Not an unreasonable stance to take. You have the perfect chance to case me, right there, so go ahead and do it.

Hmm, seems she's soft-claiming Aragorn as her character, but this doesn't reveal much about specific abilities associated with it.

Would be a weird scum tactic to soft-claim it, because there is almost definitely an Aragorn somewhere, and it is likely associated with town. Counter-claims would be interesting.

If we do have something like a role cop, Hapi might not be a bad scan choice in the night.

Tbh Lau, I strongly disagree I think Hapi would be one of the worst scan choices for several reasons:
a) This is such a Hapi thing to do to hint at her own role or information (she's even mentioned that she likes to do that in a previous game) that really I have no doubt of its truth.
b) I don't think scum would allow her to draw this much attention to herself in the fear that she would be checked.
c) There could possibly be roles that allow for messing with the results of a check and since she's a more obvious target for checks now I consider that any results may be purposefully screwed with as the result of prediction.
d) Lastly, ngl Hapi is pretty low on my list of highest susses right now anyway, I think far more could be gained in terms of information from so many other people.

I'm a little surprised you would say something like that. It makes me feel that you're subtly deflecting from yourself. I am aware that I've said you were deflecting as a wolf in the past, but my point still stands here and now. :p

That said, please point me in the direction of where Hapi has done this.

That said, please point me in the direction of where Hapi has done this.

I do purposely play chaotic but I also usually leave hints to my role in small things like this

From the Summersend Game.

Okay, that makes your progression here difficult to track. Was I in that Summersend game?

Okay, that makes your progression here difficult to track. Was I in that Summersend game?

No you were not, it was from this year. If you want to read it you can click on the quote message header and that brings you to the quote itself. (Just found that out now o.O) She was a wolf that game, which was tree-themed with the wolves being lumberjacks, that quote was in reference to her aversion to the tree puns profilic throughout the game. :p I'm just imagining that she is taking it one step farther, the Summersend being the latest game she has played to my understanding.

Alright, so it could track that you think she's doing a repeat here, but I'm having severe issues with your certainty. To me, it seems like the logical next step to an established pattern of behaviour would be to use it to the benefit of scum, as well, particularly if, by doing so, she can make players like you unquestionably accept her as Town, to the point of being 100% certain. That almost seems like too much information, in fact. It also seems uncharacteristic for someone as sharp as you to not consider the clear scum-benefits this could accrue if used correctly.

It's a sharp observation that Wolf-me would want to do this as a tactic not to be scanned N1, for once, but that also seems rather lazer focused. I don't recall you showing much of an interest in any scumspects besides Gerrick, up to this point, and Gerrick can be considered rather low-hanging fruit. You have not appeared overtly solvey, and based on your interaction with Sapph, I am beginning to suspect that you have been waiting to try and see if you can case me. Not taking into consideration that I do not have that much knowledge of Hapi as you do is equally eye-raising.

Alright, so it could track that you think she's doing a repeat here, but I'm having severe issues with your certainty. To me, it seems like the logical next step to an established pattern of behaviour would be to use it to the benefit of scum, as well, particularly if, by doing so, she can make players like you unquestionably accept her as Town, to the point of being 100% certain. That almost seems like too much information, in fact. It also seems uncharacteristic for someone as sharp as you to not consider the clear scum-benefits this could accrue if used correctly.

It's a sharp observation that Wolf-me would want to do this as a tactic not to be scanned N1, for once, but that also seems rather lazer focused. I don't recall you showing much of an interest in any scumspects besides Gerrick, up to this point, and Gerrick can be considered rather low-hanging fruit. You have not appeared overtly solvey, and based on your interaction with Sapph, I am beginning to suspect that you have been waiting to try and see if you can case me. Not taking into consideration that I do not have that much knowledge of Hapi as you do is equally eye-raising.

My certainty as you put it is not based only on the factors of possibility I personally observe, but rather a combination of that, my gut reads, and the direction the game is taking. I may also say that if more information comes up that I find relevant I may refute my certainty. I'm not telling you or anyone else to think of her as clear, this is just my own personal opinion. That being said I do feel that scanning her is a rather bad choice for tonight and felt the need to state that. Ofc I have considered that she is pulling one over on me/us, I even mentioned that she could be purposefully misleading us, but that is just not clicking true in my head right now. I see what you mean about using it for the benefit of scum for sure, but I'm not seeing it yet. As of what is characteristic for me, I don't think that's a very strong base anyway for determining my alignment, I'm still finding my own playstyle, not having much experience.

I would think you would understand why I would be lazar-focused on you. You've been very active and have talked a lot, and I find myself growing increasingly wary of people in the position of taking over the town, justifiably so. I also consider that you may be using your position as the experienced player to appear townie to our newcomers as well. Setting yourself up as the (idk really what I mean here but I know what I see dang it) spokesperson they should talk to puts a lot of authority on yourself and could be used to farther the goals of scum should you be one. I mentioned that I town-read you earlier, that does not mean you still can't be wolf. Just because I've been using Gerrick publicly does not mean I'm not sussing anyone else, it just means he's the one I'm most comfortable pushing right now. Ofc I've been trying to case you, you set yourself up in a very strong position from D1. I don't know exactly what you mean by solvey. I don't understand what part of it is eye-raising specifically, could you please elaborate?

Basically Lau, I have my own opinions on the players and the actions they've taken, and I'm using my own logic and knowledge to justify it as far I as feel comfortable doing so. I don't expect people to follow me, I want them to follow themselves (preferably in the direction I'm going but that's just my bias :p). I reserve the right to let my own opinions to influence what I say and the actions I take. There's probably more I could say but I've already written a lot and I don't want to wax on about this.

Alright, so it could track that you think she's doing a repeat here, but I'm having severe issues with your certainty. To me, it seems like the logical next step to an established pattern of behaviour would be to use it to the benefit of scum, as well, particularly if, by doing so, she can make players like you unquestionably accept her as Town, to the point of being 100% certain. That almost seems like too much information, in fact. It also seems uncharacteristic for someone as sharp as you to not consider the clear scum-benefits this could accrue if used correctly.

It's a sharp observation that Wolf-me would want to do this as a tactic not to be scanned N1, for once, but that also seems rather lazer focused. I don't recall you showing much of an interest in any scumspects besides Gerrick, up to this point, and Gerrick can be considered rather low-hanging fruit. You have not appeared overtly solvey, and based on your interaction with Sapph, I am beginning to suspect that you have been waiting to try and see if you can case me. Not taking into consideration that I do not have that much knowledge of Hapi as you do is equally eye-raising.

My certainty as you put it is not based only on the factors of possibility I personally observe, but rather a combination of that, my gut reads, and the direction the game is taking. I may also say that if more information comes up that I find relevant I may refute my certainty. I'm not telling you or anyone else to think of her as clear, this is just my own personal opinion. That being said I do feel that scanning her is a rather bad choice for tonight and felt the need to state that. Ofc I have considered that she is pulling one over on me/us, I even mentioned that she could be purposefully misleading us, but that is just not clicking true in my head right now. I see what you mean about using it for the benefit of scum for sure, but I'm not seeing it yet. As of what is characteristic for me, I don't think that's a very strong base anyway for determining my alignment, I'm still finding my own playstyle, not having much experience.

I would think you would understand why I would be lazar-focused on you. You've been very active and have talked a lot, and I find myself growing increasingly wary of people in the position of taking over the town, justifiably so. I also consider that you may be using your position as the experienced player to appear townie to our newcomers as well. Setting yourself up as the (idk really what I mean here but I know what I see dang it) spokesperson they should talk to puts a lot of authority on yourself and could be used to farther the goals of scum should you be one. I mentioned that I town-read you earlier, that does not mean you still can't be wolf. Just because I've been using Gerrick publicly does not mean I'm not sussing anyone else, it just means he's the one I'm most comfortable pushing right now. Ofc I've been trying to case you, you set yourself up in a very strong position from D1. I don't know exactly what you mean by solvey. I don't understand what part of it is eye-raising specifically, could you please elaborate?

Basically Lau, I have my own opinions on the players and the actions they've taken, and I'm using my own logic and knowledge to justify it as far I as feel comfortable doing so. I don't expect people to follow me, I want them to follow themselves (preferably in the direction I'm going but that's just my bias :p). I reserve the right to let my own opinions to influence what I say and the actions I take. There's probably more I could say but I've already written a lot and I don't want to wax on about this.

It's not just a play-style thing, it's a question of competence. You are competent enough and, I would imagine, realistic enough to see the clear red flags of placing your faith so fully in Hapi. You're also being extraordinarily evasive about what makes you this certain. Just saying "my gut" and "the direction of the game" is not showing me your progression, and the irony is not lost on me that I'm calling you out for said evasive ess, either. Unfortunately for players like you, once you have shown yourself to be have that much potential, any logical inconsistency or irrational move you make will scream sus to me. And there is a clear contradiction in your thought-patterns here, as well. If you considered that she's pulling one over on us, you cannot simultaneously be completely certain. Especially if you don't show me the progression about how you got from "yeah, this is potentially a bit screwy" to "bruh, you're about to waste a night power and also how dare you try and be evasive again." I would also like to point out that I became ever so slightly concerned about her possibility to false-claim exactly because of your post mentioning the possibility of a ploy.

As for why your point about being laser-focused and justifiably so, again, there is a clear lack of progression in how you got to this. You stated very early on that this is just my usual MO, so I don't understand why you'd focus on that more than so much else happening right now. Certainly, I can have a devastating impact on the game if I am a Wolf and have positioned myself as Town leader, but worrying about this to the exclusion of all else is damaging to Town, because 1) It would absolutely be in the Wolves' best interest to remove said Town leader, especially in a game where there are so many new players who would just faff about aimlessly if not provided with direction, and 2) you are not getting any useful insights from any other players. "You have been very active and talked a lot" is also not exactly the best reason to be wary. What has the content of my posts been? Can you case those? (Yes, I know you're going to focus on the "Lau is evading the night scan!" angle, and yes, that's valid and I'm quite impressed by it, but you are not getting a free pass by virtue of only one thing you've finally been able to nail me with).

The part that was eye-raising is that your own experience with Hapi clearly played a big role in your alleged certainty in her Town status, and the truthfulness of her claim (I've already shown the inconsistency of your thought process and progression to this, so that's not what I'm focusing on now), yet you didn't consider that I was not a witness to those past actions myself, and then jumped straight to casing me about it instead of filling me in on the context that I was clearly sorely in need of.

Your last paragraph is basically just reiterating a point you already made in your first paragraph, and is a conclusion that I don't see as necessary, either, because I didn't accuse you of trying to sway people's votes or opinions in the first place.

So I'm stuck in a predicament. Do I try and get you voted off already, because you have now become my own main scumspect, but also risk losing a damn essential player if you are actually misguided Town, or do I keep you around with the risk that you just laser-focus on me the whole damn game and we derail the whole thread with our bickering?