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Proposal: Mateo Regional Cutie Pie Act
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Michi
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  • Where exactly did I argue that he didn't deserve his commendation?

    You didn't exactly argue that specifically, but the way you're comparing his getting a commendation for basically doing what Mateo did for longer just sounded like you were cheapening his getting it, even if that wasn't the intention (which I know it wasn't).  So I'm just clarifying that while no, we couldn't grab anything concrete, Reon was more than just a positive face on the forums for his time here.
    1 person likes this post: taulover
    « Last Edit: October 13, 2019, 07:04:07 AM by Pengu »
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    Michi
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    Laurentus
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  • As the one who brought up Reon's commendation and literally just said he's Wintreath Personified, all this really shows me is that you and I have a very different perception of Mateo, seeing as I'm legit comparing his demeanour and presence in the region to that of Reon, one of the people I respect most from Wintreath's history. I'm saying that the nature of Reon's presence, and by extension the nature of Mateo's presence, in and of itself was so positive and welcoming so as to leave a mark, and change the community for the better by making it a more friendly, welcoming place. And that's just as valuable to the community as a list of thousands of accomplishments.
    In die donker ure skink net duiwels nog 'n dop, 
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    Laurentus
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    Michi
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  • As the one who brought up Reon's commendation and literally just said he's Wintreath Personified, all this really shows me is that you and I have a very different perception of Mateo, seeing as I'm legit comparing his demeanour and presence in the region to that of Reon, one of the people I respect most from Wintreath's history. I'm saying that the nature of Reon's presence, and by extension the nature of Mateo's presence, in and of itself was so positive and welcoming so as to leave a mark, and change the community for the better by making it a more friendly, welcoming place. And that's just as valuable to the community as a list of thousands of accomplishments.

    And I get that, I do.  But your first post about him was literally saying "do you even realise Reon got his commendation simply for being such a positive presence in the region?"

    Which was completely not true.  Yes, Reon was an active and positive presence for a good while, even if we experienced the tail-end of his activity, with the commendation happening after he had disappeared.  However, his reasoning for the commendation went deeper than that...not only being just a positive force, but one that did accomplish quite a bit in his years here regardless of us being able to pinpoint them specifically.  Sure, he was friendly, but he was also active in government for a time, active in the forums as well as the chat, and was a part of the Riksrad as well.

    We love active members here, and we love friendly and welcoming members here.  But those alone don't warrant a commendation...otherwise we'd be handing out a lot more than we already do.  Mateo is a lovely person to talk to on Discord, but I don't think we should be comparing them to Reon just yet when it's only been a couple of months and they haven't done really much outside of Discord.  They're very friendly, definitely, but they're not to the point where I'd compare them to someone who you yourself called Wintreath Personified, when he earned that title from more than just being a friendly face on our chat channel (which would have been IRC at that time).
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    Michi
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    Doc
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  • because titles through the Storting will be frivolous and easy to get, it makes the entire concept of storting-granted titles suspect and frivolous
    oh Chanku, you shouldn't have
    this is such a gift to me given my legislative agenda for this session

    Attention all Wintrean citizens: if you want a title that's come from the Storting, sound off, let's just make an omnibus bill and hand these out like fucking candy!
    4 people like this post: Michi, Laurentus, Arenado, Imaginative Kane
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    Michi
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  • because titles through the Storting will be frivolous and easy to get, it makes the entire concept of storting-granted titles suspect and frivolous
    oh Chanku, you shouldn't have
    this is such a gift to me given my legislative agenda for this session

    Attention all Wintrean citizens: if you want a title that's come from the Storting, sound off, let's just make an omnibus bill and hand these out like fucking candy!

    I mean....

    Quote
    Oh, and if the storting retro-actively gives titles to past Commendation recipients, please make my title absolutely silly with just a ring of seriousness in it (Might I suggest "Protector of shiny gems and drunken sailors" and then something genuine at the end?).  If we're really worried about diminishing something as inconsequential as a title on a messageboard, then I suggest we go the next step and actually just give someone a silly title attached the their commendation, and I volunteer as tribute for that, being as that I am by nature quite silly.



    I just want a title to go with my commendation.  :P
    1 person likes this post: Laurentus
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    Michi
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    Mateo406
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  • Citizens, and honorable persons of the UH and government body in general, allow me to be heard...

    I have been mostly silent on the forums simply because I choose to be. I take no part in running in any election because I choose not to; it's best left to those who know what they're doing.

    Allow me to Express my deepest gratitude on considering an honorary title, it means quite a bit.

    I have read the continued debate over issuing such a title, and a number of things have been highlighted to my thoughts. I was shocked that this was ever even considered, I never thought it would be, and now that it is, I am profoundly honored. I assure you, this title, should it pass, grants no power, no authority, no real prestige beyond a simple "thank you, for being you..." which is quite a gift.

    But I must admit, there are some things that I find somewhat...wrong. I've spent some time considering "the spirit of wintreath" and it's not, imo, about policy, procedure, technicalities, votes, bureaucracy or any of that. I see wintreath as a group of people, from all walks of life, from many places, coming together in the spirit of community and friendship. We talk, we share, we laugh, we cry... and sometimes we fight...but we are all of us, together, growing as a group, and as individuals.

    Chanku, you seem obsessed with procedure, titles, achievements and tangible accomplishments. In the spirit of wintreath, I believe you are wrong. I've been here longer than 2 months. I've remained mostly silent, as I was new to wintreath, but I've since grown. I've changed. I've made friends, I've laughed, I've cried, I've been angry, and I've even fought. But I still grew.

    I recall a time, not but a couple of weeks ago, when older members of the community were reminiscing of past members and how far wintreath has come and how much its grown and even some of the struggles you have all has to overcome. But I also remember you, chanku, going on in detail of all of your accomplishments. And on. And on. And on. It reeked of elitism and arrogance. It seemed an obsessive want for recognition of what you've already accomplished and what most already knew.  You seem convinced that I have accomplished nothing.

    You are wrong, chanku.

    Most of my accomplishments are not written in the great halls of history of wintreath or in the tedium of legal texts, I've won no great political victories nor written any legislation. Does that make me any less honorable than you? The fact that I choose not to play an active role in government means that I should be... nothing? Or anybody else for that matter?

    My accomplishments are more personal, and individual. You do not know of the very deep, very profound and life changing conversations I've had with people, many of them in this government. But I do not crow my accomplishments, I do not brag about them. Why? Because I talk to people to learn and to help and be helped. Because I care about them, not about achieving an accomplishment. I could if you like... and sound like an arrogant, pompous jerk... but I wont. That's not who or what I want to be.  If you insist that titles be given only to those who have tangible accomplishments, then I propose to this body an implementation of term limits, so everybody has a chance to shine, and barring you from crowding out the otherwise silent. But that wouldn't be fair to you either. You are a wonderful, brilliant and incredibly dedicated person, and you deserve better, and so do we from you. Your focus on political and tangible success is wrong. I'm sorry, but you are wrong about me.

    This title, in my eyes, isnt a mere frivolity. It's people saying thank you, for being you... and it means alot to be so honored, even in such a whimsical way.

    Thank you for your time.
    3 people like this post: taulover, Arenado, Laurentus
    Mateo406
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    Wintermoot
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  • @Mateo406: I just wanted to say that I thought your post was beautifully written, especially the parts about what Wintreath is to you and your experience here. I don't think I've ever seen it put so briefly yet eloquently. :)


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    Wintermoot
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    taulover
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  • This is very interesting for me, because I don't participate much on Discord outside of government channels and #tavern. Whereas I have tabs on literally everything happening on the forums, I'm somewhat disconnected from the sub-community that's grown on Discord. (I recently noticed this, for instance, when I didn't realize that Moot was helping get people to work on the Orendi and was surprised when it happened.) As a consequence, I barely know who Mateo is at all.

    The way this has many different reactions, as Laurentus noted, probably reflects different views of people in our community (in this particular case, Mateo), which I think likely stems from the individual interactions people have had, which (in contrast to forum interactions) is highly time-dependent in chat platforms, and as such are also highly varied. I think this is continuing to grow as our Discord community continues grow relative to our forum community.

    Just a thought I had, putting it out here I guess since it's kinda relevant. Anyway, it's clear that it's not my place to comment on this particular case because I really don't know Mateo or this segment of the Wintrean community in general despite other prominent members speaking highly of him.
    3 people like this post: Imaginative Kane, Laurentus, Gerrick
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    taulover
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    Michi
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  • I just dont see what the hubub is about, honestly.  The Storting would only be giving him the title in name only, as he already calls himself the Regional Cutie Pie on Discord, and is welcome to do do on here already.  It's not a commendation, elevation, or Riksrard appointment, and not even official title being given, just being recognized.

    All this act would be is Wintermoot (and officially the storting) attaching it to him being a positive force on Discord, and I think that's fine.

    I'll be honest, I think the resistence coming from Chanku is because she's literally the only other member with a Storting recognized title.  If she didn't have hers, I very highly doubt she'd be this resistant to someone else getting one (and I'll honestly say, being known as "Champion of the Just" but resisting the Monarch wanting to honor someone, even in title regardless of content because you're afraid of it diminishing titles....to me that sort of cheapens your own when you're literally the only title holder in Wintreath so far).
    1 person likes this post: Laurentus
    « Last Edit: October 14, 2019, 04:24:53 AM by Pengu »
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    Michi
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    Doc
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    i don't wanna be That Guy, but 'she', my dude
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    German
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  • As speaker, I'd like to just allow a bit more time of discussion and some closing statements, if you choose to put some forward, for this act.
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  • EDIT:
    On the suggestion of North, I will instead propose the legislation that used to exist here as a separate piece of legislation, in addition to the MRCPA, rather than attaching it as a rider.
    « Last Edit: October 14, 2019, 12:15:25 AM by Doc »
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    Michi
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  • snip
    i don't wanna be That Guy, but 'she', my dude
    oh snap, thanks.  I'm well aware, but I've been used to calling her by her past pronoun for so long that it slips up sometimes.
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    Michi
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    Doc
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  • oh snap, thanks.  I'm well aware, but I've been used to calling her by her past pronoun for so long that it slips up sometimes.
    oh I thought you might have been on a break from Wintreath when she said it and it had just not come up before, my b on that end
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