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[DEBATE] Prohibition on Citizenship in the New Pacific Order
Posts: 15 Views: 2249

Chanku
  • Citizen
  • Quote
    Title
    1. This act is to be cited as the Prohibition on Citizenship within the New Pacific Order.

    Amendments
    2. Section 2.1 of the Citizenship and Demonym Act is amended to read as follows:
    Quote
    Citizens are required to keep the nation which they gained citizenship with within the region unless they inform the person (or government agency) empowered to accept or reject citizenship applications in accordance with relevant law of a change in Citizenship Nation, with the new nation they wish to designate as their Citizenship nation. Citizens that have made five posts on the Wintreath forums during the previous calendar month, after their second month of citizenship, are exempted from this requirement. Any individual wishing to obtain citizenship must have a nation within the region in order to qualify for citizenship. No citizen of the New Pacific Order is eligible for Citizenship within the realm.

    I introduce this act as a last-minute act to discuss this, recently the New Pacific Order has been revealed to have infiltrated multiple regions including Lazarus (pre-Civil War and during the Civil War), TRR, Osiris and other regions. This was overseen and ran by the Pacific government, with knowledge of the Emperor, and as such at this time it is in the best interests for regional security to prohibit dual citizenship.
    See you later space cowboy.
    Old Signature

     
    Current Positions in Wintreath
    Matriarch of House Kaizer
    Speaker of the 29th Underhusen
    Advisor to the Riksråd
    Positions I've held
    Riksrad(1st Jarl of Information, 3rd Jarl of Foreign Affairs, 2nd Jarl of Defense)
    Member of the WHR
    Speaker of the Underhusen (3rd)
    Speaker Pro Tempore of the Underhusen (1st)
    Underhusen Member (1st-3rd)
    Member of the 5th Overhusen
    Chairman of the 5th Overhusen
    6th Underhusen
    Speaker of the 6th Underhusen
    Mandate Holder for Jarl of Defense
    Member of the 8th Storting (Underhusen)
    Royalty of Wintreath
    Ambassador for the Department of Foreign Affairs.
    Underhusen Terms I've been a part of
    1st Underhusen
    2nd Underhusen
    3rd Underhusen
    6th Underhusen
    8th Underhusen
    Overhusen Terms I've been a part of
    5th Overhusen
    Families I've been a part of
    Kaizer - Matriarch (REFORMED)
    Kestar - Child of Wintermoot (REMOVED)
    Chanku
    Katie
  • Former Citizen
  • The Cheese
  • What is the consensus among other regions about this (especially GCRs)?
    Lady Katherine Ostergaard
    Countess of Osterfell, Matriarch of the Noble House of Ostergaard


    Resumé
    Contact
    Discord: Katie#3933

    Wintreath
      • Fmr. Thane of WA Affairs
      • Fmr. Jarl of Foreign Affairs
      • Fmr. Skrifa in the 29th-34th & 36th Sessions of the Underhusen
      • Fmr. Officer of Information in the 29th-34th Sessions of the Underhusen
      • Fmr. Speaker Pro Tempore in the 33rd Underhusen
      • Fmr. Thane of Integration
      • Fmr. Thane of Embassies

    Other
    • Fmr. Councillor of World Assembly Affairs in Cynosure
    • Fmr. Outreach Officer of the Rejected Realms
    • Fmr. Kaetunet of the 1st House of Commons of the Holy Reich of Bunicken
    • Fmr. Grand Councillor in Grand Central
    • Fmr. Local Councillor in the South Pacific
    Katie
    • The Cheese
    • Posts: 730
    • Karma: 722
    • hoh
    • Former Citizen
    • Pronouns
      She/Her/Hers
      Familial House
      Ostergaard
      Wintreath Nation
      Logged
    Chanku
  • Citizen
  • Osiris is declaring, or has declared, war. Lazarus is considering war. TWP has pulled treaties with the NPO. TSP, TNP, TEP, TRR, and Balder have not exactly done much at this time that I know of.
    See you later space cowboy.
    Old Signature

     
    Current Positions in Wintreath
    Matriarch of House Kaizer
    Speaker of the 29th Underhusen
    Advisor to the Riksråd
    Positions I've held
    Riksrad(1st Jarl of Information, 3rd Jarl of Foreign Affairs, 2nd Jarl of Defense)
    Member of the WHR
    Speaker of the Underhusen (3rd)
    Speaker Pro Tempore of the Underhusen (1st)
    Underhusen Member (1st-3rd)
    Member of the 5th Overhusen
    Chairman of the 5th Overhusen
    6th Underhusen
    Speaker of the 6th Underhusen
    Mandate Holder for Jarl of Defense
    Member of the 8th Storting (Underhusen)
    Royalty of Wintreath
    Ambassador for the Department of Foreign Affairs.
    Underhusen Terms I've been a part of
    1st Underhusen
    2nd Underhusen
    3rd Underhusen
    6th Underhusen
    8th Underhusen
    Overhusen Terms I've been a part of
    5th Overhusen
    Families I've been a part of
    Kaizer - Matriarch (REFORMED)
    Kestar - Child of Wintermoot (REMOVED)
    Chanku
    Katie
  • Former Citizen
  • The Cheese
  • Osiris is declaring, or has declared, war. Lazarus is considering war. TWP has pulled treaties with the NPO. TSP, TNP, TEP, TRR, and Balder have not exactly done much at this time that I know of.

    I would highly recommend holding off until we know the consensus among the GCRs. We don't want anyone to be able to use this against us.
    Lady Katherine Ostergaard
    Countess of Osterfell, Matriarch of the Noble House of Ostergaard


    Resumé
    Contact
    Discord: Katie#3933

    Wintreath
      • Fmr. Thane of WA Affairs
      • Fmr. Jarl of Foreign Affairs
      • Fmr. Skrifa in the 29th-34th & 36th Sessions of the Underhusen
      • Fmr. Officer of Information in the 29th-34th Sessions of the Underhusen
      • Fmr. Speaker Pro Tempore in the 33rd Underhusen
      • Fmr. Thane of Integration
      • Fmr. Thane of Embassies

    Other
    • Fmr. Councillor of World Assembly Affairs in Cynosure
    • Fmr. Outreach Officer of the Rejected Realms
    • Fmr. Kaetunet of the 1st House of Commons of the Holy Reich of Bunicken
    • Fmr. Grand Councillor in Grand Central
    • Fmr. Local Councillor in the South Pacific
    Katie
    • The Cheese
    • Posts: 730
    • Karma: 722
    • hoh
    • Former Citizen
    • Pronouns
      She/Her/Hers
      Familial House
      Ostergaard
      Wintreath Nation
      Logged
    Chanku
  • Citizen
  • I can tell you that the consensus among most regions is against the NPO. TNP has denounced the NPO and Balder has closed its embassy with TP.

    Additionally the following regions are at war with the NPO:
    - The Black Hawks (declared by the NPO)
    - Hartfelden (Declared by themselves)
    - The Midnight Order (Declared by themselves)
    - Canterlot (Declared by themselves also against TBH)
    - A GCR

    The following regions have denounced and penalized the NPO But not officially declare War.
    - TRF (with something that is effectively a DoW)
    - TNP (with potential DoW later)
    - TRR

    Additionally it seems like TWP has strongly taken a stance against the NPO internally.

    As it seems most GCRs have little faith in the NPO and current attitude is against the NPO.

    Additionally the matter of Citizenship is largely an internal measure. The NPO has shown themselves to be untrustable and is a potential security threat. They are also generally to be considered enemies of the realm due to repeated statements by (albeit now former) Consul Pergamon against the region and our king.
    See you later space cowboy.
    Old Signature

     
    Current Positions in Wintreath
    Matriarch of House Kaizer
    Speaker of the 29th Underhusen
    Advisor to the Riksråd
    Positions I've held
    Riksrad(1st Jarl of Information, 3rd Jarl of Foreign Affairs, 2nd Jarl of Defense)
    Member of the WHR
    Speaker of the Underhusen (3rd)
    Speaker Pro Tempore of the Underhusen (1st)
    Underhusen Member (1st-3rd)
    Member of the 5th Overhusen
    Chairman of the 5th Overhusen
    6th Underhusen
    Speaker of the 6th Underhusen
    Mandate Holder for Jarl of Defense
    Member of the 8th Storting (Underhusen)
    Royalty of Wintreath
    Ambassador for the Department of Foreign Affairs.
    Underhusen Terms I've been a part of
    1st Underhusen
    2nd Underhusen
    3rd Underhusen
    6th Underhusen
    8th Underhusen
    Overhusen Terms I've been a part of
    5th Overhusen
    Families I've been a part of
    Kaizer - Matriarch (REFORMED)
    Kestar - Child of Wintermoot (REMOVED)
    Chanku
    Arenado
  • Citizen
  • Some Random Guy
  • I'm sorry, I've been kinda busy, what happened in the NPO?
    I Hope You Have A Nice Day :]
    Arenado
    • Some Random Guy
    • Posts: 5,557
    • Karma: 2,209
    • Comfortably Numb
    • Citizen
    • Pronouns
      Any/All or They/Them
      Familial House
      Eske
      Wintreath Nation
      Logged
    trader
  • Former Citizen
  • Wintreath's Unofficial Official Merchant
  • I don't know if I should be allowed to discuss this here or if my perms weren't removed, but considering the potential urgency of the matter, I must interject. Should we be handling this in a public forum as it is a matter pertaining to national security?
    1 person likes this post: Katie
    Remember, there is no reason to panic, nothing is on fire.
    trader
    • Wintreath's Unofficial Official Merchant
    • Posts: 303
    • Karma: 210
    • Mercury 'trader' Kestar
    • Former Citizen
    • Pronouns
      He/Him/His
      Familial House
      Kaizer
      Wintreath Nation
      Logged
    Katie
  • Former Citizen
  • The Cheese
  • I don't know if I should be allowed to discuss this here or if my perms weren't removed, but considering the potential urgency of the matter, I must interject. Should we be handling this in a public forum as it is a matter pertaining to national security?

    Possibly not. We could move this to the Private Storting Forum if you wish.
    Lady Katherine Ostergaard
    Countess of Osterfell, Matriarch of the Noble House of Ostergaard


    Resumé
    Contact
    Discord: Katie#3933

    Wintreath
      • Fmr. Thane of WA Affairs
      • Fmr. Jarl of Foreign Affairs
      • Fmr. Skrifa in the 29th-34th & 36th Sessions of the Underhusen
      • Fmr. Officer of Information in the 29th-34th Sessions of the Underhusen
      • Fmr. Speaker Pro Tempore in the 33rd Underhusen
      • Fmr. Thane of Integration
      • Fmr. Thane of Embassies

    Other
    • Fmr. Councillor of World Assembly Affairs in Cynosure
    • Fmr. Outreach Officer of the Rejected Realms
    • Fmr. Kaetunet of the 1st House of Commons of the Holy Reich of Bunicken
    • Fmr. Grand Councillor in Grand Central
    • Fmr. Local Councillor in the South Pacific
    Katie
    • The Cheese
    • Posts: 730
    • Karma: 722
    • hoh
    • Former Citizen
    • Pronouns
      She/Her/Hers
      Familial House
      Ostergaard
      Wintreath Nation
      Logged
    Arenado
  • Citizen
  • Some Random Guy
  • Or we could post a sister topic in the citizen's platform.
    I Hope You Have A Nice Day :]
    Arenado
    • Some Random Guy
    • Posts: 5,557
    • Karma: 2,209
    • Comfortably Numb
    • Citizen
    • Pronouns
      Any/All or They/Them
      Familial House
      Eske
      Wintreath Nation
      Logged
    Katie
  • Former Citizen
  • The Cheese
  • Or we could post a sister topic in the citizen's platform.

    Yeah but that's even more public than this forum. The concern is that we shouldn't be doing this in the open.
    Lady Katherine Ostergaard
    Countess of Osterfell, Matriarch of the Noble House of Ostergaard


    Resumé
    Contact
    Discord: Katie#3933

    Wintreath
      • Fmr. Thane of WA Affairs
      • Fmr. Jarl of Foreign Affairs
      • Fmr. Skrifa in the 29th-34th & 36th Sessions of the Underhusen
      • Fmr. Officer of Information in the 29th-34th Sessions of the Underhusen
      • Fmr. Speaker Pro Tempore in the 33rd Underhusen
      • Fmr. Thane of Integration
      • Fmr. Thane of Embassies

    Other
    • Fmr. Councillor of World Assembly Affairs in Cynosure
    • Fmr. Outreach Officer of the Rejected Realms
    • Fmr. Kaetunet of the 1st House of Commons of the Holy Reich of Bunicken
    • Fmr. Grand Councillor in Grand Central
    • Fmr. Local Councillor in the South Pacific
    Katie
    • The Cheese
    • Posts: 730
    • Karma: 722
    • hoh
    • Former Citizen
    • Pronouns
      She/Her/Hers
      Familial House
      Ostergaard
      Wintreath Nation
      Logged
    trader
  • Former Citizen
  • Wintreath's Unofficial Official Merchant
  • I think moving the conversation to the PSA would be for the best.
    Remember, there is no reason to panic, nothing is on fire.
    trader
    • Wintreath's Unofficial Official Merchant
    • Posts: 303
    • Karma: 210
    • Mercury 'trader' Kestar
    • Former Citizen
    • Pronouns
      He/Him/His
      Familial House
      Kaizer
      Wintreath Nation
      Logged
    Laurentus
  • Regional Stability Squad
  • Count of Highever
  • There is no security concern to speak of. We have a very active founder.

    If this is declared again, it would be a moral stand at best, just like last time. I fail to see why we should care about gameplay in the slightest, as we do not even possess an active military.
    In die donker ure skink net duiwels nog 'n dop, 
    Satan sit saam sy kinders en kyk hoe kom die son op. 
    • Count of Highever
    Laurentus
    • Posts: 8,755
    • Karma: 4,635
    • Look on my Works, ye Mighty, and despair!
    • Regional Stability Squad
    • Pronouns
      He/Him/His
      Familial House
      The Noble House of Valeria
      Wintreath Nation
      Logged
    Arenado
  • Citizen
  • Some Random Guy
  • Perhaps it would be best to leave this to the next UH? Our mandate is about to run out anyway.
    I Hope You Have A Nice Day :]
    Arenado
    • Some Random Guy
    • Posts: 5,557
    • Karma: 2,209
    • Comfortably Numb
    • Citizen
    • Pronouns
      Any/All or They/Them
      Familial House
      Eske
      Wintreath Nation
      Logged
    Chanku
  • Citizen
  • First off I would HEAVILY like to state that if you are not a member of the Underhusen, or the Monarch, do not comment here without being invited. It is procedural incorrect and is disrespectful to the Underhusen and our rules.

    In any case, there is no security concern. First off, all the information I have relayed is public information, it is not privileged in any form. As such there is no security risks for discussing this in a public forum. As the Honourable Laurentus also said, we have an active founder and thus have less issues concerning security.

    Next I would like to state that I am highly uncomfortable with privately discussing an act which would effect current and future citizens, and the ability to gain or keep citizenship in private. Such discussions belong in the public, so that we can have the response of the citizens available. This act would, potentially, strip citizenship from someone who otherwise would be eligible for citizenship, and bar others. As such we owe it to the populace to discuss this in the clear, and not just pass it out of nowhere with little public debate.

    As to waiting until the next term, we still have roughly two weeks left, additionally this is a somewhat time-sensitive issue in that failing to do this quickly will likely reflect badly upon us if the rest of the GCRs were to look at this, especially with potential information that I do have that is privileged involving other GCRs, which is partially why I have introduced this measure, next is the fact that it will be roughly two weeks and four days until we can debate this once more, assuming we have a Speaker election and that the session isn't shortened due to run-offs.

    As to why we should care, we are tied to NS, and we do have to interact with them. Many of our members are from other NS regions as well, as such we do have to have some GP presence. Finally is that we need to be involved in Gameplay for our own sake, as otherwise people will spread malicious rumors that we can not know of, or combat, as was displayed with Lazarus.
    1 person likes this post: taulover
    See you later space cowboy.
    Old Signature

     
    Current Positions in Wintreath
    Matriarch of House Kaizer
    Speaker of the 29th Underhusen
    Advisor to the Riksråd
    Positions I've held
    Riksrad(1st Jarl of Information, 3rd Jarl of Foreign Affairs, 2nd Jarl of Defense)
    Member of the WHR
    Speaker of the Underhusen (3rd)
    Speaker Pro Tempore of the Underhusen (1st)
    Underhusen Member (1st-3rd)
    Member of the 5th Overhusen
    Chairman of the 5th Overhusen
    6th Underhusen
    Speaker of the 6th Underhusen
    Mandate Holder for Jarl of Defense
    Member of the 8th Storting (Underhusen)
    Royalty of Wintreath
    Ambassador for the Department of Foreign Affairs.
    Underhusen Terms I've been a part of
    1st Underhusen
    2nd Underhusen
    3rd Underhusen
    6th Underhusen
    8th Underhusen
    Overhusen Terms I've been a part of
    5th Overhusen
    Families I've been a part of
    Kaizer - Matriarch (REFORMED)
    Kestar - Child of Wintermoot (REMOVED)
    Chanku
    Syraj
  • Former Citizen
  • I am in favour of this. As an way to keep allies, considering we do not do R/D, we need to show we don't support what NPO have done.
    1 person likes this post: Katie
    Résumé

    Citizen: 23 June - Present,
    Wintreath's Finest July 2018,
    Speaker Pro Tempore of the 29th, 30th and 31st Underhusen,
    RP Guild Rank: Layman
    Ambassador to Hartfelden: 11 October -
    Present,
    Thane of Roleplay, December 2018 - Present.
    Syraj
    • Posts: 363
    • Karma: 122
    • I am totally not sleazy. My products are top quality.
    • Former Citizen
    • Familial House
      Kaizer
      Wintreath Nation
      Logged
     
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